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Author Topic: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"  (Read 1685 times)

Offline FarmerRick

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Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« on: February 24, 2014, 10:13:14 PM »
http://zbroya.info/en/blog/2650_ukrainian-gun-owners-associations-official-statement/

Today every citizen of Ukraine understands why our country has hundreds of thousands of policemen. Last illusions were crushed when riot police used rubber batons and boots at the Independence Square on peaceful citizens.

After such actions we realize that it is not enough to only adopt the Gun Law.

As of today Ukrainian Gun Owners Association will start to work on the preparation of amendments to the Constitution, which will provide an unconditional right for Ukrainian citizens to bear arms.

New wording to be introduced:

3) amend Article 27, paragraph four as follows:

"Everyone has the right to freedom of owning a firearm to protect their life and health, housing and property, life and health of other people's constitutional rights and freedoms in the case of usurpation of power, the encroachments on the constitutional order, sovereignty and territorial integrity of Ukraine. Exercising the right to free possession of firearms is governed by applicable law and may be limited only by the court on the individual. "
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Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

Offline bkoenig

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2014, 08:07:24 AM »
Awesome.  They're learning a lesson we've forgotten.
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Offline UPCrawfish

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2014, 09:10:34 AM »
Quote from: FarmerRick on February 24, 2014, 10:13:14 PM
Exercising the right to free possession of firearms is governed by applicable law and may be limited only by the court on the individual. "

I'm not a lawyer and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night but I read this as a "NO GO" sentence......
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Offline bkoenig

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2014, 09:40:32 AM »
Quote from: UPCrawfish on February 25, 2014, 09:10:34 AM
I'm not a lawyer and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night but I read this as a "NO GO" sentence......


I think what they're saying is that an individual's rights may only be limited through due process in a court of law, not by a blanket ban on all citizens.  So a criminal could have their rights limited as part of their sentence, but the government can't pass a law limiting possession by the citizens as a whole.
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Offline AWick

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #4 on: February 25, 2014, 11:14:06 AM »
That was my interpretation of that reading as well.

A thing that should be noted here was that leaders and governments all across Europe and our own president pressed the leadership to stand down and acquiesce their demands after just a few people were injured or killed. There were only a few thousand people that stood together and brought down a ruling party in a country of 45 million. That's a similar lesson to the fact that the only 3% of the colonial population was involved in the American Revolution. We are seeing good victories in court for our cause and we need to elect those who will actually represent us. I am so thankful to live in this country where we DO have the 2A, even if it has been restricted a great deal.
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"Well-regulated" meant well equipped, trained and disciplined... not controlled with an iron fist.

Offline RedDot

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #5 on: February 25, 2014, 08:30:11 PM »
The idea that "our" president had any hand in restoring civil order in Ukraine is BS WH propaganda.  The only world leaders who bother to act as if they take Barry O seriously are the ones who are just hoping for a WH dinner and the chance to meet JayZ. 

I'm not sold this is over yet.  I think they've won a small victory and some breathing room, but I'm leery of the fact that Putin has yet to react.  Sochi "play nice" memories are still fresh but once those begin to fade we may see a Russian response and Putin is definitely in the category of those who couldn't give a damn what the Obama Adm. has to say.

On the 2A ideas, it was interesting to see that when security forces came armed with rifles, pictures showed the citizens meeting that with pistols and shotguns.  Thus the line about protection in the case of usurpation of power and the encroachments on the constitutional order seemed very appropriate.
« Last Edit: February 25, 2014, 08:38:31 PM by RedDot »
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Offline bkoenig

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2014, 07:13:43 AM »
If there is war over this it will be over The Crimea.  It's part of Ukraine but populated mostly by Russians, and it's Russia's only warm water naval port.  They're not about to let that go.
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Offline RedDot

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2014, 05:29:56 PM »
Looking like Putin just dropped the other shoe...
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Offline shooter

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #8 on: March 03, 2014, 11:14:18 PM »
  I bet they really wish the had a second amendment.
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Offline NENick

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #9 on: March 04, 2014, 07:05:41 AM »
Well, I thought I'd only ever see the Cold War from a history book... We get to enter this one with a weakened military, and during jimmy Carter's 3rd term. God help us
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Offline JimP

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Re: Ukrainians work to get their own "2nd Amendment"
« Reply #10 on: March 04, 2014, 09:08:19 PM »
Quote from: NENick on March 04, 2014, 07:05:41 AM
Well, I thought I'd only ever see the Cold War from a history book... We get to enter this one with a weakened military, and during jimmy Carter's 3rd term. God help us

We are well into Jimmy Carter's 4th term ..... and "Jimmah", while a pretty weak president and just as Economically Illiterate and feckless in the foreign policy arena as Our Dear Reader, was at least a decent man who loved his country.  The same, I do not believe, cannot be said of the current Resident of 1600 Pennsylvania Ave. ......

My brother called me today with this thought: 

Obama to Ukraine: "If you like your Crimea, you can keep it."

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The Right to Keep and BEAR Arms is enshrined explicitly in both our State and Federal Constitutions, yet most of us are afraid to actually excercise that Right, for very good reason: there is a good chance of being arrested........ and  THAT is a damned shame.  III.
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