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Army marksmanship

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wallace11bravo:
The Army Qual is a joke, IMO.

The Targets are Ivans (~30" X 16") from 150-300, and head and shoulders E-types for 50 and 100. Meters, not yards.

40 rounds total, 40 targets total. All scoring is hit-miss.
23 to get marksman (minimum passing)
30 to get sharpshooter
36 to get expert

20 rounds prone supported (sandbags)
10 rounds prone unsupported (can use the magazine, but I wouldn't recommend it)
10 rounds kneeling
As long as it is safe and not expressly prohibited, it is allowed, position wise. He will be wearing full kit.

The 300 only comes up four times, so you can miss it every time and still get expert. The targets are friggin huge and stay up for 3-5 seconds depending on how far away they are. There are some double targets, that come up at the same time at different ranges.

I never went to traditional basic, I went to Sand Hill: Infantry OSUT. A month after the surge was announced, and I wore a flack jacket from Vietnam. I can only share my experience there:

The equipment is indeed the crappiest of the crappy. Amazing how my rifle was turned in for armory reset AFTER qualification. I was sleep deprived. The actual marksmanship training was a joke. Keep in mind: Basic is just that: Basic. It is familiarization and indoctrination. You don't really gain any knowledge or skills, you just get to where there is a base for knowledge and skills to start.

OSUT was a fairly inconsequential part of my career, and I only remember bits and pieces. I couldn't tell you a single name of anyone that was there, or even which battalion I was in. It really just didn't matter compared to the training I received and experiences I had later on.

What MOS? If he is going combat arms, he will qual twice, once with irons and once with optic (a probably broken aimpoint).

Now for a bit of venting:

These days, it is a kinder, gentler, and lower budget army, so they will probably give him a red ryder BB gun to shoot a tin can at 5 feet, and give him a participation ribbon and a pat on the head if he does a bad job. But whatever, its not like the Army is supposed to be a war-fighting organization or anything.

gsd:
Jeez John, tell us how you really feel:)

OnTheFly:
I had the privilege of sitting next to a Ranger on a flight to Lincoln.  He related his frustration with the Army's fitness requirements.  He said that the Army was unhappy with the pass rate so they lowered the standards.  Pass rates went up...at least for a while until everyone got used to the new lower standards and set their sights lower.  Then pass rates fell right back to where they were previously.

Hmmmm.  There might be a lesson in there somewhere that could be related to raising children, government assistance, minimum wage, and a lot more I'm sure.

Fly

shooter:
I was in the army 71-73, we had the same pop up targets, but they were so full of holes, when they flipped up. the top would keep going and fold the targets in half, back then most of the rifles were fairly new

JTH:
Can't help it, have to derail the thread briefly...


--- Quote from: wallace11bravo on March 22, 2014, 02:09:32 AM ---10 rounds prone unsupported (can use the magazine, but I wouldn't recommend it)
--- End quote ---

Mags don't handle it well?  Gun is so banged up that it won't be reliable?

Reason I ask is because I use my mag as a prone support all the time in Multigun.  :)  But, since I'm using PMAGs in guns that I've taken care of, that might be the difference. 

Or have you seen significant malfunction issues due to using the mag as a support in general with well-kept firearms and good mags?

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