NO CCW in Lincoln City Parks - NFOA Legal thoughts?

[Husker_Fan]

I like the reasoning, but I also have IBM stock and bonds in my retirement account. That doesn't mean I can walk into the CEO's office, put my feet up on the desk and tell him I own it.

[GreyGeek]

The OP gave a link to the AG opinion on CCW but didn't mention the paragraph which answered the question he asked of the city attorney:

2 While not able to prohibit permitholders from carrying concealed handguns anywhere in the city, a city or village could still, under the next-to-last exception in § 69-2441(1)(a) of the act, prohibit permitholders from carrying concealed handguns in specific places or premises that it directly controls. For example, a city or village could ban concealed handguns in city-owned parks, buildings, recreation facilities, arenas, etc. The city or village would have to comply with the procedures outlined in § 69-2441(2) regarding the posting of notice.

This city park problem isn't a battle that should be pursued. 

What we should using our energy for is a law to restore Constitutional Carry in the entire State, just like five other States have.   We used to have Constitutional Carry in all the States in this nation.   As youth in the late 1950s I took a bus 3 miles to down town Denver and purchased two M1 Garands for $75, no questions asked.  I took the bus home carrying them.  No one gave me a second look.  Everyone owned guns and had them in their homes, cars, trucks, pickups AND concealed in their pockets and purses.  No politician thought it a problem that people had a right to protect themselves using the same weapons and methods that crooks and thugs use.

It wasn't until 1927 that a nationwide prohibition on mail-order concealed weapons  was banned.   In 1934 unlicensed possession of automatic weapons was banned.   The anti-2nd Amendment infringements were made more onerous when the Federal Firearms Act of 1938 places the first limitations on selling ordinary firearms. Persons selling guns are required to obtain a Federal Firearms License, at an annual cost of $1, and to maintain records of the name and address of persons to whom firearms are sold. Gun sales to persons convicted of violent felonies were prohibited.  In 1964  I was in college in Texas when President Kennedy's assassination was announced on the radio.   In August of 1966, while I was in grad school,  that same radio announced the death of Charles Whiteman, the Texas Tower shooter, who was later discovered to have been afflicted with a brain tumor.   Two years later, in 1968, the Gun Control Act of 1968 massively decreased a citizen's Right To Bear Arms. 

Another big change was the capture of the Democrat party in 1968, at its Chicago Convention, by the Extreme Left.   Since that time the Democrat part has been the locus of ALL actions designed to infringe and if possible repeal the 2nd Amendment.  Lately, they've been pressing for repeal of the Constitution, calling it an outmoded document, or a "little book".   

We've been shooting too low.

[Gary]

November 22, 1963 12:30

[SeanN]

I like the reasoning, but I also have IBM stock and bonds in my retirement account. That doesn't mean I can walk into the CEO's office, put my feet up on the desk and tell him I own it.

Did someone force you with the rule of law to invest in IBM? Is the CEO's office open to the public? No? Not the same.

[TwoSwords]

So this is the answer from the City attorney.

The City ordinance is valid under state law, but to successfully prosecute someone who has a concealed carry permit for violating the ordinance it would be necessary to establish either that there was conspicuous posting of the prohibition on possession of firearms at the location where the violation occurred, or that a representative of the City informed the permit holder of the prohibition and asked that the weapon be removed from the property, which request was refused. 


As one final point I said, why have the ordinance if we know the Lincoln Parks are not conspicuously posted? 

One of the City Council members came back with, we will look at the City Park Posting.

Good, news they will be hard pressed to prosecute someone unless they are caught standing right in front of a sign in a city park.  I run around Lincoln, but have not been in a City park in years, so I don't know what the posting looks like if any.   You can always say, what sign?

Bad news, you could still be the test case and all this is untested in court.  Don't walk past signs.

[TwoSwords]

What we should using our energy for is a law to restore Constitutional Carry in the entire State

While I agree with the goal, you will never get this in a first bite, unless I misunderstood your meaning.

Follow the Kansas model, baby steps is the way to go.   If you try to go there in one step the Anti's will scream, "We can't have all these UNTRAINED people walking around with guns."  Wrong yes, but the public almost always buys this.

The rights were taken away slowly,  you will never get them back in one chunk.

Even in KS we have not ditched CCW training yet, and not yet gained Constitutional Carry.

This is the steps I would suggest, you can arrange the order as you see fit.

Remove the Force of Law from the No Gun sign.   Walk past a sign in KS, they can ask you to leave that's it.
Public Building Carry,  Tax payers paid for them, we carry in them.  Put in the metal detectors or allow CCW, Period.  KS DONE.
Get rid of the Bar Carry Ban 51%  - KS Bar Carry OK
Alcohol Carry - .08  Same as Driving - KS, UT  - I don't even drink but NE Zero Tolerance is over the top.  (Yes I know they don't mix, I don't drink)
School Grounds carry - Yes
And the latest.
State Wide preempted Open Carry - KS  July 1, 2014 effective date.

You need the last one before you'll get anywhere near ConC.  IMHO.  Once you have the last item, people can Open Carry without the CCW training.  Then you have them.
One more step to get to ConC.

I'm not here to debate Open Carry v. CCW, I'm just saying its a helpful tool if  you want to get to ConC.

Go study the CCW permits in various states.  There are 3 models generally speaking.

1) Some Mandated State Training-  KS, UT,  NE, MO, IL, TX  plus
2) Take an NRA Class  - IA Model  IRC
3) Give money get permit
4) Constitutional Carry - AK

You'll not get from #1 to #4 in one step, especially in the NE Unicameral, unless all the liberals are voted out.

[Gary]

Erosion seems like the normal, expected consequence of time marching on.  It could be house paint, beach front property, or constitutional rights.

I have never seen a house, slowly get painted, or beach front property restore itself.

When the wall around East Germany came down, it was not slowly, it was all at once.

My avatar photo, was a victory, that fell in our favor, in the blink of an eye.

[rudy]

I brought the topic of no ccw in parks up in another thread in conjunction with the Lincoln city libraries, which are posted.  Basically the response from folks on the board was that if the city posts the property, it is a legal posting and cannot be carried past.  But really, what gives the city the authority to post a publicly owned property?  The city parks and libraries are in effect owned by us, the taxpayers.  It is a load of BS in my opinion.  Publicly owned property should not be able to be legally posted.

[aceflyer]

On the topic of changing state law/constitution, has a state-wide referendum or initiative been investigated to solidify preemption, or change the state constitution?  I realize this is difficult and lengthy process; however, based on what I'm reading, the signatures have to be evenly distributed on the petition, so the liberals in the main cities don't have all the power.  It's a more broad-based process across the state.  I would imagine as you get outside Lincoln and Omaha the views expressed here are more wide spread. 

I have heard that in other states, this process was not used typically for firearm laws because you'd get all sorts of outside gun control groups pumping money into the state against it.  But I'm not sure it isn't worth a try.