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Baltimore shooting, this time...

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JTH:
With the suddenly large number of public shootings that have occurred, and more importantly, been plastered on the news all within the last week, I just can't wait to see what new laws the legislature (and even worse, Congress) is going to attempt to enact in response.

I did have to add this one, though---the shooting in Baltimore.  The two bold sections were my added emphasis.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110109/ap_on_re_us/us_baltimore_shooting

Police: 2 dead, 4 hurt in Baltimore club shooting
By KASEY JONES, Associated Press

BALTIMORE ? A fight at a Baltimore nightclub spilled onto the street early Sunday and led to an eruption of gunfire that killed a police officer and another man and left four people hurt, police said.

One of those wounded also was a police officer, who was shot in the leg, said police spokesman Anthony Guglielmi. Investigators were trying to determine if officers may have fired on a fellow officer whose badge and other identifying markings came off his uniform during the scuffle, he said.

No arrests have been made, but dozens of people were being questioned, Guglielmi said.

Authorities said officers arrived at the Select Lounge to find a large fight and called for backup. Investigators still weren't sure if anyone besides officers had fired their weapons.

"It was a pretty significant fight from what we understand. A large fight and a number of officers responded," Guglielmi told The Associated Press. "It ultimately spilled outside into the parking lot."

The police spokesman said the dead officer was 33 and an eight-year veteran of the department but said he likely wouldn't be identified until Monday. He also did not give the name of the other male victim.

Guglielmi said the second officer was shot in a leg and was expected to recover. The others wounded also were not identified, but the spokesman said they were in their 20s.

Meanwhile, investigators were at the club trying to piece together events.

"We have a lot of ground to cover, a lot of people to talk to," he said.

At dawn Sunday, police tape surrounded the block of Select Lounge. No one answered when a reporter knocked on the door and police asked a reporter and photographer to leave.

Police tape also surrounded a parking lot containing about 25 cars and lay in the foyer of the club. The club is in a mixed industrial and residential area not far from the hospital where victims had been taken.

A valet parking sign for the club was knocked down, but there were no readily apparent signs of shots fired.

Sunday wasn't the first time the city's nightlife has been rocked by shootings. In March, two people were shot outside the Velvet Rope nightclub when a fight inside the club spilled onto the street.

And on June 5, off-duty police officer Gahiji A. Tshamba was out in a neighborhood known for its nightlife when authorities say he shot and killed an unarmed Iraq war veteran. Police say Tshamba and Tyrone Brown had gotten into a heated argument when Tshamba shot Brown 12 times with his department-issued Glock handgun. Tshamba has been charged with murder.

DaveB:
Cops shooting cops, does anyone else see a problem here?

sjwsti:
 
--- Quote from: DaveB on January 09, 2011, 10:15:27 AM ---Cops shooting cops, does anyone else see a problem here?

--- End quote ---

Tragic situation, I sure hope that ends up not being what happened.

- Shawn

JTH:
I think that if any police officer legally doing their job gets shot, it is NOT a good thing.

What I find most interesting about this article is the lack of several things.

Where is the furor from the media that cops were shooting and no one else was?

Where is the commentary about whether or not a large fight (that doesn't apparently have any news reporters listing ANY weapons other than what the officers brought) merited a lethal force response?

And why, pray tell, does the article title talk about a "Baltimore Club Shooting" when it seems as if it was actually a "Police shooting outside a club"?  They say "an eruption of gunfire" in their typical purpose prose, and yet they don't comment on the fact that said "eruption" apparently wasn't coming from criminals?

Hmm.....in another article, (http://www.upi.com/Top_News/US/2011/01/09/Two-Baltimore-officers-shot-one-dies/UPI-17201294578402/)  we see the following:

There was an altercation that took place very near the club and some officers worked to intercede in that fight, at which time some gunshots were discharged," said Police Commissioner Frederick H. Bealefeld said. "Several officers fired multiple shots."

This was in response to a crowd control situation.  "The incident happened early Sunday morning when police were called to break up fights and control a crowd outside the Select Lounge, The Baltimore Sun reported."

Crowd control and multiple gunshots don't normally go together.  What started it, I wonder? 

"What we need to figure out is what sparked the shooting," said Anthony Guglielmi, a police spokesman. "Was there a weapon drawn by a civilian? Was the officer's weapon taken? We've got to put together a timeline and figure out what happened."

Now that is interesting.  The police spokesman (several hours later) doesn't know why the officers started shooting---and you'd think that would be the first thing the police officers in question would state, when asked. 

"Why'd you start shooting?"

"Um...I dunno...."

I can think of several justifiable reasons for a crowd control situation to turns into a "shots fired" situation---and yet, if several hours later, not a single officer can state a reason, then apparently none of them happened.

So why did the officers start shooting into the crowd, I wonder?

Read this, and figure out what hasn't been said by the police in any way:

http://weblogs.baltimoresun.com/news/crime/blog/2011/01/two_officers_shot_one_killed_o.html

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/baltimore-city/bs-md-ci-select-lounge-shooting-20110109,0,827574.story

(I also note that the other officer who was shot, got it in the foot---and since no one was aiming in his direction [all the other officers were shooting at one guy, who wasn't shooting back at them] I guess we know how he got shot there, don't we?)

sjwsti:

--- Quote from: jthhapkido on January 09, 2011, 05:56:19 PM --- "What we need to figure out is what sparked the shooting," said Anthony Guglielmi, a police spokesman. "Was there a weapon drawn by a civilian? Was the officer's weapon taken? We've got to put together a timeline and figure out what happened."

Now that is interesting.  The police spokesman (several hours later) doesn't know why the officers started shooting---and you'd think that would be the first thing the police officers in question would state, when asked. 

"Why'd you start shooting?"

"Um...I dunno...."

I can think of several justifiable reasons for a crowd control situation to turns into a "shots fired" situation---and yet, if several hours later, not a single officer can state a reason, then apparently none of them happened.
--- End quote ---

I think its best to actually wait untill the facts come out so we know what actually happened before a judgement against the officers is rendered.

I, for one, dont plan on giving a complete statement to anyone immediately following a deadly force incident. Im going to contact my attorney and give myself time to prepare what I will say. These officers have that same right.

Maybe they screwed up, maybe not. Its certainly too early to tell. 

- Shawn

 

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