General Categories > Carry Issues
Shooting in Westroads?
1hickey:
I for one am glad the woman happened to be at the church in Colorado. That could have ended up much, much, worse than it did. As was stated on the blog, though, when you are in such a situation, you don't know for sure how you will respond. As the writer stated, it would have been much different for him had his wife and child been there (as they were the night before). Again, I'm glad the woman at the church had her wits about her. Not everyone that has a weapon will use one in such a situation. In discussing the law of war, we say "the trigger belongs to the gun, the trigger finger belongs to the soldier. The two are separated by a moral choice". The choice is clear to me, as a soldier. There isn't much moral shakedown to situations as we have seen this past week except for the bystander caveat.
I have been on the fence regarding personally having a CCW. For me, the issue of location in the current law nearly outweighs the priviledge of CCW in this state. I'm a maintenance manager at a class C school. The talk today here by staff and admin has been that they wish I would carry here at work since I have been weapons trained by the military. Unfortunately, NElaw prohibits all except law enforcement and criminals from carrying a weapon in schools, churches, etc. Even if the organization WANTED a person or persons to carry on site. That includes open carry as far as I can read.
A bit of a rant- Maybe it's my military background, but how do people think that there is security without trained AND armed personnel? Security is not a bunch of harsh signs, alarms, lights, and dudes in polyester uniforms being paid minimum wage. What are they supposed to do in a violent situation? Use harsh language? What will Westroads do with the signs they took down? Just rewrite them, make them bigger? That will surely help ::). Security is a supersition without highly trained and motivated individuals guarding what is precious. This is why we have a military. Now, tell me I can't have the option of force projection to protect my family and friends. Excrement!
I must admit, though, that I am still on the fence a bit with the CCW thing. Is is really worth having CCW permit when you can't legally carry that weapon AT ALL in the places and towns where you would most want to. In fact, I would be a criminal myself for carrying in most locations and in violation of my CCW permit. I am not yet very concerned about violence in Cass County. Omaha, Lincoln, Plattsmouth, etc. are a different story.
Thoughts everyone??
Jay:
Ok, 1hickey, so the current law is definitely flawed. We all know that here. But we don't have much of a chance of getting it fixed if all the fence riders take the stand that they will wait until it gets better to spend the money. I'm not picking on you here, I'm just coming at this from a different angle. Lawmakers are not looking at the low number of permit holders as a symptom of the law being flawed, they look at it as a symptom of Nebraskans not really feeling the need to get a permit period. In my opinion, everyone in the state that believes in the second amendment should get a CHP whether they actually plan on carrying or not, just to show people that we will and do support any legislation that supports our rights to keep and bear arms, not to mention simply protecting ourselves. Lawmakers would be much more apt to listen to the concerns of tens of thousands of citizens than a couple thousand permit holders.
Besides, so what you are saying is that because the current law limits you from carrying in certain places, you would rather go unarmed all the time instead of part of the time? That makes no sense to me. (Affirmative defense aside.) A permit lets you legally carry concealed in many places in both Omaha and Lincoln.
Now save up some chips and get your danged permit private! ;D
JimP:
--- Quote from: 1hickey on December 10, 2007, 04:54:58 PM ---
I have been on the fence regarding personally having a CCW. For me, the issue of location in the current law nearly outweighs the priviledge of CCW in this state. I'm a maintenance manager at a class C school. The talk today here by staff and admin has been that they wish I would carry here at work since I have been weapons trained by the military. Unfortunately, NElaw prohibits all except law enforcement and criminals from carrying a weapon in schools, churches, etc. Even if the organization WANTED a person or persons to carry on site. That includes open carry as far as I can read.
A bit of a rant- Maybe it's my military background, but how do people think that there is security without trained AND armed personnel? Security is not a bunch of harsh signs, alarms, lights, and dudes in polyester uniforms being paid minimum wage. What are they supposed to do in a violent situation? Use harsh language? What will Westroads do with the signs they took down? Just rewrite them, make them bigger? That will surely help ::). Security is a supersition without highly trained and motivated individuals guarding what is precious. This is why we have a military. Now, tell me I can't have the option of force projection to protect my family and friends. Excrement!
I must admit, though, that I am still on the fence a bit with the CCW thing. Is is really worth having CCW permit when you can't legally carry that weapon AT ALL in the places and towns where you would most want to. In fact, I would be a criminal myself for carrying in most locations and in violation of my CCW permit. I am not yet very concerned about violence in Cass County. Omaha, Lincoln, Plattsmouth, etc. are a different story.
Thoughts everyone??
--- End quote ---
Because you can't carry everywhere, you carry nowhere? Because the law is not perfect, we just give up???? Do what you can...... to do less is being lazy.
The Lesson in the latest shootings is the same: When a goblin bent on Murder appears, he will kill as many people as he wants to, unless someone with the Mindset, Skills, AND Hardware stops him. The best way to ensure that someone is wherever you are is to do everything you can BE that somone. "Everything" includes getting your permit and carrying when you can. It includes practice. It includes letting businesses know you don't spend money where Carry is Prohibited. It includes going to hearings and board meetings and pointing out the stupidity of more regualation of Law Abiding Citizens.......... it isn't easy. A Free Society is not easy. But it is worth it.
If the staff there wishes you could carry, remind them if wishes were horses, we could all ride and eat free horseburgers. Have them let State Sen Brad Ashford and their own Legislator know that they don't appreciate working in a "Gun Free Zone/Human Hunting Area". Tell them to remind their Lawmakers that the FACT that Murder is against the law and guns are not allowed in the Mall did not stop the von Maur maniac. If the threat of lawsuits causes businesses to eliminate their "No Gun Zones", the SCHOOLS and CHURCHES are the next best targets. Making things MORE illegal won't stop criminals. THEY ALREADY IGNORE THE LAWS. Making more gun laws will just make it harder for Law Abiding Citizens to be armed. It worked on YOU, didn't it? Coming from non-gun owners, it would get Ashford's attention better. He seems to write off Pro-Carry people as "Gun Nuts."
Do all that you can. To do less is being lazy.
Jay:
Another facet of this is that this is going to affect more than just those who choose to carry a handgun. There are going to be implications from this event that will affect the owners of AR-15s, AKs, Mini 14s, and even Walmart 22s if we are not vigilant.
Now, more than ever, is the time to stand up and be heard.
1hickey:
Thanks, guys. I see everyone's point. Lincoln may not have extra laws like O does concerning carry, but nearly everywhere you go in this town sports a no weapons sign. Its really fascist, to say the least. Heck, there is not one school public or otherwise in this whole city that has a JROTC. We here at LC would, but we're too small to support it given the federal funding guidelines.
The biggest problem for the administration here on pursuing real security (i.e. me carrying) is that it isn't only a legal issue. There are just too many folks out there who don't understand. here at LC, they seem to be on one side or the other. Some parents and staff have been asking me to carry nearly since I arrived and the other side wants no guns whatsoever in thier community. It's a conundrum to say the least. Unfortunately, most people won't change thier minds until something horrible happens to them. Like I mentioned before, the recent school shootings over the past year along with Westroads and the Colorado church have already made more folks vociferous around here. I can only hope that we can generate enough common sense to get things worked out on the legal side.
But, I have to also support the rights of property owners who choose to not allow weapons on thier property. Just as I believe it is my right to carry if I choose, it is also thier right to say "not around me". As stupid and circular logic as I may think that is, it is still thier right as a private citizen. I get absolutely livid when people bash the military, burn the flag, and other general verbal attacks against our nation, but as citizens, it is still thier right to voice opposition. That is the core of what I am sworn to defend- the Constitution. My rights don't usurp thiers, and vice versa.
When it's all said and done, I think I will save up for the CCW course and permit. I'll need to also purchase an appropriate weapon. However, I won't be able to carry the majority of the time here in Lincoln. I would be in violation of my permit.
BTW- when is that Plattsmouth city council meeting?? ???
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