New "facts" emerge on the Newton Massacre

[NE Bull]

And I use the word "Facts" very loosely. 
Just the way this article is written, and the use of specifics in some descriptions and vagueness with others, makes it all seem, ummmm, fabricated?   IDK, but me gut ain't having a good feelin' here.

 http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CONNECTICUT_SCHOOL_SHOOTING?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-03-28-09-57-19


Also boys (and gals) be aware, a Historical War Rifle, a bolt action .22, and bb gun and a starter pistol constitutes a "Cache of Weapons"

Maybe our Math guys can help me out here;   3, 30 round mags = 3 x 30 right?  3x30 comes out to , ummm multiply... carry the 1....  90?   Unless the rules have changed, that doesn't add up to 154.
Even it they mean, in addition to the one in the rifle, that is still    ..... only  120. Right?

And  Google "Enfield Albian bolt-action rifle". seems the only reference to this firearm is this AP article.

[GreyGeek]

They are just trickling out the  same old info trying to keep the "outrage" as high as they can to  work up citizen indignation enough that they would write  to  the elected officials and demand "action".
I got an email from Obama's political organization a couple days ago saying that they were starting a round of media ads to push this tactic.

[altheman2]

I like how the first paragraph of the article went from ammo....to hundreds of rounds of ammo....to thousands of rounds of ammo

[kozball]

All of this could be settled if they would just release the security video........

[NE Bull]

Be careful, with talk like that, you, too may be getting a visit from the boys in the nice suits!

[kozball]

Oh, I'm sorry. I forgot that the nice suits don't want it settled.  Gotta keep the pressure on like GG said. Influence the low information voters. 

[RedDot]

I can't help but wonder.... How many rounds would he have gotten off if an armed security guard was present?  How many did he get off while the police were mustering outside?  How many did he get off before they had their entry plan settled upon?  ... Mostly though, how many dead Americans, (children, Border Agents, Ambassadors), would it take for Obama to pass up golfing with Tiger?   Yet WE should all be ashamed for letting this issue lie... Screw you, Barry 

[Gary]

You almost have to get your tin foil hat out of mothballs to follow along closely with this story.

Very odd story if you go down all the rabbit holes. 

[Wymore Wrangler]

It really makes you wonder about the "facts" in this case, first he had a AR, then he didn't, he had four pistols, no AR found, and now all of the sudden, he had a AR again when Obama is trying to whip up support for his illegal gun legislation...

[bigdog]

And I use the word "Facts" very loosely. 
Just the way this article is written, and the use of specifics in some descriptions and vagueness with others, makes it all seem, ummmm, fabricated?   IDK, but me gut ain't having a good feelin' here.

 http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_CONNECTICUT_SCHOOL_SHOOTING?SITE=AP&SECTION=HOME&TEMPLATE=DEFAULT&CTIME=2013-03-28-09-57-19


Also boys (and gals) be aware, a Historical War Rifle, a bolt action .22, and bb gun and a starter pistol constitutes a "Cache of Weapons"

Maybe our Math guys can help me out here;   3, 30 round mags = 3 x 30 right?  3x30 comes out to , ummm multiply... carry the 1....  90?   Unless the rules have changed, that doesn't add up to 154.
Even it they mean, in addition to the one in the rifle, that is still    ..... only  120. Right?

And  Google "Enfield Albian bolt-action rifle". seems the only reference to this firearm is this AP article.

Well, I teach Math and your calculations are quite accurate. You did very well, even without a calculator. People who wrote this report must need a calculator.

I thought about these numbers the minute this was reported. You beat me to it, Bull.

[Hank]

I think this is the same article that I clicked on earlier today from the google news page...so disgusted I could not finish reading it. Need I say more?

[Gary]

Hope we have seen the last of the mass shootings.

[GreyGeek]

Very odd story if you go down all the rabbit holes. 

And most of those holes were created by the  major media for their  purposes.  For example, NBC reported that no assault rifle was used.  They were right.  It was as semi-auto rifle, but that's beside the point.  The media just published speculation without checking.

But, youtube is filled with conspiracy theory videos, ranging from claims  that some of the parents are actors, the whole thing was a "false flag", etc.

One thing is not a theory ... the media is using every and each  excuse, regardless of how slight or disconnected from Sandy Hook, to repeat the story endlessly.  The reason for that is obvious -- an  attempt to marshal public opinion for their desire to eventually ban and confiscate guns.

[Greybeard]

There will never be an "end" to the mass shootings! Some "idiot" will see an opportunity to "best" the last shooter and see his/her name and image in lights and go down in history. The mainstream media will be only too happy to oblige him/her and the anti gunners will wring their hands as they gleefully push their agenda to disarm the people who could stop this carnage if we were allowed to be armed in the "free fire zones" //rant off//

[johnnyblack]

Maybe our Math guys can help me out here;   3, 30 round mags = 3 x 30 right?  3x30 comes out to , ummm multiply... carry the 1....  90?   Unless the rules have changed, that doesn't add up to 154.
Even it they mean, in addition to the one in the rifle, that is still    ..... only  120. Right?

Don't get me wrong, here - i think the media has obviously sensationalized the issue and this is being drug out for no comon sense reason.  Why is this an ongoign investigation?  Why can't they just release the information they have - i.e. content of journals (at least basic), security footage (at least some still photos would be appropriate). 

What I feel is lost in the whole story and what is underemphasized here, is the fact that the kid clearly had free access to the firearms - despite the fact that he was plainly and chronically mentally ill.  The guns were obtained legally by the mother but she failed in her responsibility to keep them out of his hands.  Obviously, she did not think he was going to do what he did, but would you not at least have the shadow of a doubt that letting him have access to mulitple firearms would be a really, really bad idea anyway?

As for the math...I think something is missing from the OP analysis - here is what the article said...

he fired a total of 154 rounds...and

"Lanza went through six 30-round magazines for the Bushmaster, although half of them were not completely empty, and police said he had three other 30-round magazines in addition to one that was in the rifle."

so, he WENT THROUGH 6 mags.  6 x 30 = 180...plus the one in the well, so a total of 210 rounds were loaded into the weapon.  Half of the mags were empty (so at LEAST 90 rounds fired), half were "not completely empty".

Even if the remaining  4 magazines (3 being the other "half" plus the mag in the gun) were all exactly half empty that's another 60 rounds.  (4 mags = 120 rounds divided by 2).

90 + 60 = 150. 

I don't think there is any proof there that he could not have shot 154 out of a potential 210.  Who knows how many rounds were in the "not empty" mags - (wish we did!) but it is reasonable to assume they were not all only half empty.

Regardless, if the kid had the force of will to execute small children in cold blood what would have stopped him from bombing the school in the absence of firearms availablity - or any other number of various methods of harming/killing 26 people?

The bottom line: one person did this, after ILLEGALLY obtaining firearms from his mother - who failed to exersize caution and common sense in her ownership responsibilities. 

[johnnyblack]

more specifically...http://www.ct.gov/despp/cwp/view.asp?Q=521730&A=4226

"Later the shooter went to Sandy Hook Elementary school where he shot his way into the building and killed 20 children and 6 adults with a Bushmaster .223 caliber model XM15 rifle. The Bushmaster was loaded with a 30-round capacity magazine. Fourteen rounds were in the magazine when the Bushmaster was recovered by police. There was one round in the chamber.

The shooter took his own life with a single shot from a Glock 10 mm handgun. He also had a loaded 9mm Sig Sauer P226 handgun on his person. Recovered from the person of the shooter, in addition to more ammunition for the handguns, were three, 30-round magazines for the Bushmaster, each containing 30 rounds. Located in the area of the shootings were six additional 30-round magazines containing 0, 0, 0, 10, 11, and 13 live rounds respectively. One-hundred-and-fifty-four spent .223 casings were recovered from the scene."

[Phantom]

From MSNBC theres a complete list of what he had or was found

At the school:

1 Bushmaster .223 caliber model XM15 rifle with a 30-round magazine
1 Glock 10mm handgun
1 9mm Sig Sauer P226 handgun
1 Saiga 12 shotgun with two magazines containing 70 rounds
6 30-round magazines, three of them emptied

At the home:

Guns:

1 Enfield bolt-action .323 rifle
1 Savage Mark II .22 caliber rifle with magazine, 3 live rounds, 1 spent cartridge
1 black marksman BB gun

Ammunition:

5 Winchester 12-gauge shotgun shells cut open, with buckshot
1 white plastic bag with 30 Winchester 12-gauge shotgun shells
1 can with .22 caliber and .45 caliber bullets
8 boxes of Winchester Windcat .22 caliber bullets, 50 rounds per box
20 "Estate" 12-gauge shotgun shells
4 boxes of SB buckshot 12-gauge, 10 round per box
1 box of Lightfield 12-gauge slugs
1 box of 20 Prvi Partizan 303 British rifle cartridges
1 box of 20 Federal 303 British rifle cartridges
2 boxes of .22 long rifle Blazer rounds, 50 each box
1 box with numerous rounds of Winchester .45 caliber bullets
2 boxes of 50 rounds of PPU .45 caliber automatic
1 box of 20 rounds for Remington .223 caliber
3 boxes of Blazer 40 S&W, 50 rounds each
2 boxes of Winchester 5.56 mm, 20 rounds each
1 box of Magtech 45ACP with 30 rounds
1 empty Box of SSA 5.56 mm
1 box of Fiocchi .45 auto with 48 rounds
80 rounds of CCI .22 long rifle
6 boxes of PMC .223 rem, 20 rounds each
6 Winchester 9 pellet buckshot shells, 12-gauge
2 Remington 12-gauge slugs
3 Winchester .223 rifle rounds
31 .22 caliber rounds
2 boxes of Underwood 10 mm auto, each with 50 rounds
130 rounds of Lawman 9mm Luger
2 spent shell casings for Glock 10mm
1 empty box of Gold Dot 9mm Luger
2 empty boxes of Winchester 9mm Luger
1 box of Underwood 10mm auto with 34 rounds
1 box of 29 miscellaneous 9mm rounds
1 spent .22 shell casing
1 small plastic bag containing numerous .22 caliber bullets
1 tan bag with numerous Blazer .45 caliber bullets
1 box of Blazer .22 long rifle with 50 rounds
1 box PPU 303 British cartridges with 9 rounds
2 Winchester 9mm rounds
2 brass-colored shell casings
1 small caliber bullet (live round) labeled C

Magazines:

1 Promag 20-round 12-gauge drum magazine
1 MD Arms 20-round 12 gauge drum magazine
3 AGP Arms 12-gauge shotgun magazines
1 Surefire GunMag magazine with 8 rounds of Winchester 12-gauge, 9-pellet buckshot
2 AGP Arms 12-gauge shotgun magazines, taped together, each with 10 rounds of Winchester 9-pellet buckshot
2 empty Ram Line magazines for Ruger 10-22
1 AGP Arms Gen 2 12-gauge shotgun magazine with 10 rounds of Winchester 12-gauge, 9-pellet buckshot
1 clear plastic Ramline magazine for an AR 15
1 magazine with 10 rounds of .223 bullets

Knives:

Metal bayonet
1 6-foot-10-inch wood-handled two-sided pole with a blade on one side and a spear on the other
1 Samurai sword with a 28-inch blade and sheath
1 Samurai sword with a 21-inch blade and a sheath
1 Samurai sword with a 13-inch blade and sheath
1 knife with a 12-inch blade and sheath
1 wooden-handle knife with a 7.5-inch blade and sheath
1 wooden-handle knife with a 10-inch blade
1 knife with a 5.5-inch blade and sheath
1 black-handled knife with a 7-inch blade and sheath
1 black rubber-handled knife with 9.5-inch blade and sheath
1 white and brown-handled knife with 5-inch blade and sheath
1 brown wood-handled knife with a 10.25-inch blade
1 Panther brown-handled folding knife with a 3.75 inch blade
1 small blue folding knife

Gear:

1 Volcanic .22 starter pistol wth 5 live rounds and 1 expended round
Leightning L3 ear protection
Peltor ear plugs
Simmons binoculars
Uncle Mike's Sidekick nylon holster
Box for vest accessories
Leather dual magazine holder
Black leather handgun holster
High Sierra fanny pack
Numerous paper targets
1 cardboard targets
1 Bushnell sport view rifle scope
Plastic bag of miscellaneous parts
Safariland holster paperwork
Glock handgun manual
MD-20 20-round shotgun magazine manual
MD Arms V-Plug guide
Bushmaster XM15 and C15 instruction manual
Savage Arms bolt-action rifle manual
Glock paperwork

Miscellaneous:

Adam Lanza's National Rifle Association certificate
Nancy Lanza's NRA certificate

Three photographs with images of what appears to be a deceased human covered with plastic and what appears to be blood

Holiday card with a check from Nancy Lanza to Adam Lanza for purchase of C183 firearm
1 digital print of a child and various firearms
1 military-style uniform
Handwritten notes with addresses of local gun shops
Receipts and emails documenting firearm and ammunition supplies
Blue folder labeled “guns” with receipts and paperwork
Paperwork titled "Connecticut Gun Exchange Glock 20SF 10mm" dated 12-21-11
Sandy Hook report card for Adam Lanza
New York Times article on a 2008 shooting at Northern Illinois Unversity

Books: “Look me in the Eye: My Life with Asperger’s;” “Born on a Blue Day: Inside the Mind of an Autistic Savant;” “NRA Guide to Basics of Pistol Shooting;” “Train Your Brain to Get Happy”

1 Seagate Barracuda 500gb hard drive, damaged
1 custom-built desktop computer, no hard drive
1 Microsoft Xbox with partially obliterated serial number
One cotton swab of blood-like substance
1 tan sheet with blood-like substance
1 tan fitted sheet with blood-like substance
1 striped towel with blood-like substance

http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/03/28/17501802-guns-knives-ammo-and-gear-adam-lanzas-arsenal-item-by-item?lite

[RedDot]

I look at the list and wonder, where is the .45?  Ammo, but no gun?  Judge on the case is still keeping some details sealed so the media story may have to be altered yet again if those ever get released.

[NE Bull]

WOW! now that info sure brings things into perspective.   

I look at this list and wonder exactly how all this was acquired.   (Thinking aloud here) Either he pieced it together little by little over a period OR with all the partials I wonder if they were acquired by theft? At the range, maybe?

Also looks to me, with all the gear, the Saiga was his original go to gun.   

[Gary]

How many women choose a full size Glock 10mm?    Darn few I bet.   The FBI dropped that round because agents did not qualify well with it because of the recoil.   Hard to picture a divorced Mom and her skinny teen getting proficient on a Glock 20.    I say this having twenty years experience with my Glock 20.   I'll bet that Glock 20, 10mm,  traces back to days of the father being in the home, in one way or another.