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Its On: The Second Amendment Preservation Precision Rifle Challenge

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RLMoeller:
ENGC members may bring guests, yes.  I think it's $5 per guest, max 3.  Member must stay with the guests.

wallace11bravo:

--- Quote from: bkoenig on May 10, 2013, 09:15:08 AM ---Question - for improvised positions where you can't use a bipod from prone, is a sling an acceptable shooting aid?

--- End quote ---

The sling does see some use for unsupported positions in PRS, but generally, if you are trying to use it with improvised support, it will often prove too cumbersome to be very useful under time constraint. Shooting a completely unsupported position is fairly rare in PRS.


--- Quote from: kozball on May 10, 2013, 10:15:34 AM ---The range at ENGC does go downhill IIRC. Brings a minor adjustment to your dope. Maybe?
...................gotta figure out if RO needs to be present, since I have never used the 600 range.

--- End quote ---

In order: Yes it has some slope. I would zero on the 300 or 100 before I bothered trying to fix my zero off of a ~.90ish (going completely off memory) slope. Just making things more complicated than they need to be. The 600 does not require an RO, unless something major has changed since I was there last. Also, watch your bore offset when shooting from the prone up there, unless they fixed it, you may have to move forward of the roof quite a bit.



--- Quote from: kozball on May 10, 2013, 08:17:22 AM ---http://www.shootingvoodoo.com/


--- End quote ---

Is a great website, probably one of the best. Snipershide.com has a lot of resources, just use the search function. The snipershide online training is pretty good. The magpul PR video has (I'm using this word liberally here) "some" good info, but it is also a lot of gear pushing, and they skip past alot of the fundamentals.

Koz has the right idea though... do some research and get out and shoot!! Help each other, and if I have time, I'll come and shoot with you. If you read the match site carefully, everything that will be in the match is on there. Either it is hinted at or just flat out stated. For example: I recommend having a method of ranging targets, this tells you...? If it is not hinted at or mentioned in the match webpage, you probably don't need to worry about it :)

Also, please get in the habit of keeping your bolts open, mags out, and muzzles up during movement. These three things are weird to most new shooters, who are used to relying on safeties and carrying at the low ready, and I really don't want to DQ anyone.

*Mags out is only used for longer and awkward movements, normally keeping your bolt open (or just safety on for semi autos) will be fine for shorter/simpler movements.

*For semi-autos, the absolute best way to do this is load magazines for each firing point. If position one has 4 rounds, load a mag with four rounds. Fire at that position, your bolt locks to the rear, flip to safe, drop your mag, and you are ready to go. This can also be handy for bolt guns, so you don't end up like me and loosing time because you automatically ran the bolt after the last round, and now you have to go back through and clear your weapon before you can move.


--- Quote from: jthhapkido on May 10, 2013, 08:52:21 AM ---I'd guess that you'd get a LOT of interest in this sort of thing.  A huge amount, actually. 

--- End quote ---

I figured as much. I'm going to do quite a bit of research before attempting such a thing, as the rules have to be carefully crafted to keep the true PR guys out :) And the stages have to be crafted to be both conducive and challenging to the DM crowd. Alot of the stages for the PR match simply won't translate over very well.

BTW, I think you will really enjoy the pistol integrated into the stages of this match.

wallace11bravo:
What I might suggest for a first practice session. I often bring my laptop to the range with me so I can do this in one sitting. While not as good quality, you can do all of this inside of 600.

Developing a baseline algorithm:

1. Shoot through a chronograph 5 times, average the number. If you don't have a chrony, just guesstimate using others results (google search) or your ballistic calculator's database, if it has one.
2. Input data into a ballistic calculator, ensure all information is correct to the best of your knowledge.
3. Save and print it off if necessary.

Truing an algorithm:

1. Set at least two (preferable more) targets up at varying ranges between 300 and 1000. I usually go with 450, 600, and 800. Be sure of the range to the targets. I use GPS for this.

2. Record accurate atmospheric info.

3. Adjust from your baseline to get solid center mass hits. If you are already spot on at all ranges, you are a lucky SOB.

4. Record your dope. We are mostly worried about elevation here, not so much wind.

5. Do steps three and four for each target. Repeat step two if necessary.

6. Go back to your ballistic calculator, pull up your saved algorithm from before. Find the truing function. In exbal it is called "trajectory validation." I'm not sure for other calculators, but a google search or referencing the calculators instructions would probably prove fruitful. If your calculator doesn't have this function (such as most free online ones) you will have to adjust manually.

7. You enter your recorded data into the trajectory validation, including atmospherics. You should be able to put in at least 4 targets on any decent calculator. The program will then correct your algorithm by adjusting your muzzle velocity to what it actually is. (Even high end chronies are +/- 40fps) It should normally not mess with any other values. You can see here why consistent velocity is essential.

8. This is now your algorithm. If your going to print it off, set temp and humidity to nominal (I use 60 degrees F), and print off three different versions. One version at 500 feet density altitude (will be used for 0-1000), one at 1500 (will be used at 1000-2000), and one at 2500 (those will usually serve well for this area, although the density altitude rarely drops below 1000). I usually go with range intervals of 50, but that is all up to you. Make sure to save this algorithm, as you may find it needs further refinement.

If you believe any refinement is necessary beyond this point, it is time to set up targets and record solid data from 100-1000 in increments of 100. Retrue your algorithm like you did before. Then set your field conditions to what they really were. Start playing with the BC till it looks just perfect with every single target you recorded. Then you are good to go.

kozball:
My head hurts  ???

Lets see here, learn to shoot the old fashioned way by ranging thru your scope and throwing more ammo down range than I can afford, or the new way with a bunch of expensive gadgets that tells you what to do the 1st shot so you waste less ammo.
Quite the dilemma for the pure sport shooter.

All is good here, just my brain on overload.  ;)

wallace11bravo:
About the only thing you really need is a ballistic calculator. There are apps for most phones that are decent and have the truing function.

For weather data: Interwebs. There are weather data stations everywhere and the data can be found online. Better close than nothing.

The only thing you end up actually using in the field is a small piece of paper, usually taped to your rifle somewhere.

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