NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => General Firearm Discussion => Topic started by: Mudinyeri on July 24, 2015, 06:57:19 AM
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Brian took third place, out of 59 competitors, last weekend in the Oklahoma Run and Gun 5K. Shooting a "sponsored" rifle from RISE Armament (zeroed on steel the afternoon before the event) and sporting Trek Tech Black colors, Brian ran, climbed, carried and shot his way through 100° heat to capture his third place finish.
I managed to lose my scorecard and was disqualified as a result. My shooting was not tracked but my run time was. I would have had the second fastest run time had I not lost my scorecard. :(
The TT Black Team
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y221/Mudinyeri/Trek%20Tech%20Black/OK%20Run%20and%20Gun/IMG_1013_zpsb6brihhp.jpg)
The Cargo Net
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y221/Mudinyeri/Trek%20Tech%20Black/OK%20Run%20and%20Gun/IMG_0977_zpsueukdhqs.jpg)
Aimpoint out to 500 Yards
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y221/Mudinyeri/Trek%20Tech%20Black/OK%20Run%20and%20Gun/IMG_0985_zpsxzirsbd9.jpg)
Amazingly, no one was offended.
(http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y221/Mudinyeri/Trek%20Tech%20Black/OK%20Run%20and%20Gun/IMG_1006_zpskmckf9vo.jpg)
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Awesome! Congrats and that looks fun!
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You young, healthy guys have all the fun!!!! Congratulations to Brian. Better luck to you next time, Toby!
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Good job Brian. Congratulations
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You young, healthy guys have all the fun!!!! Congratulations to Brian. Better luck to you next time, Toby!
Who you calling young? :D
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Thanks! This was by far the most fun I've ever had in any kind of shooting competition. I can't say enough about how well run the event was and what great people the organizers are.
If you guys have a chance to check out any of RISE Armament's products I would highly recommend them. The brake on that rifle kept the muzzle very flat during the close in hoser stages, but what was really impressive was the trigger. The reset is so short that it's almost imperceptible. I've never felt anything like it. It would be an absolutely incredible trigger for 3 gun competition.
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Who you calling young? :D
If I'm young I'd hate to see what old is....
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If I'm young I'd hate to see what old is....
Apparently, Greybeard. :D
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Mr. B.
Absolutely Outstanding! Congratulations on a fine performance. You did Nebraska proud.
Goose
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Good job! Just finishing is an accomplishment. :)
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Outstanding!
....and that competition looks like a TON of fun. Except for the running part. :)
What was the longest in-between-shooting run that you had to do?
What was the hardest shooting stage? What was the most fun shooting stage? Other than the cargo net, were there lots of other obstacles? Was it more "running" or more "obstacles"?
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Outstanding!
....and that competition looks like a TON of fun. Except for the running part. :)
What was the longest in-between-shooting run that you had to do?
What was the hardest shooting stage? What was the most fun shooting stage? Other than the cargo net, were there lots of other obstacles? Was it more "running" or more "obstacles"?
There were actually two divisions - 5K and 10K. I did the 5K and that was plenty in this heat. The RO's all ran the day before the main competition and one of them did the 10k twice. That guy is either a complete stud or insane. ;D
The longest run all at once was about 2 miles down a dirt road. The 10k guys did that stretch twice, and by the time I ran (11:00) it was pretty hot, so that was pretty challenging. The first two stages were directly across the section from the rest of the course, so you had to run 1/2 mile / 1 mile / 1/2 mile to get to the third stage.
For me the most challenging shooting stage was #2, which was 2 hits each on steel at 200, 300, and 500 yards. I was shooting an unfamiliar rifle with an Aimpoint and I didn't know the holdovers so that was pretty tough. The gun was very accurate, though, and as long as I could see my POI I could adjust and hit my target. I wasn't able to see any splash on the 500 yard steel so I wasn't able to connect on that one.
I would say stage 1 and stage 3 were tied for the most fun. Stage 1 was a fast, short range stage. It's funny, but the trigger actually slowed me down a little on the first target. You had to put 5 rounds each on four different paper plates, and after the first doubletap I kind of paused in shock at how fast it was. After that it was ON. ;D Stage 3 was 1 shot each on steel from 250 yards, from 4 different positions - a rooftop, the hood of a truck, through a chain link fence, high barricade, and under a low barricade. I lost my left earplug somewhere in between stages 2 and 3 so I shot that stage one handed, with my left index finger in my ear and the rifle forend rested on the stage props. At the next stage I dug out a 9mm round and was in the process of jamming it in my ear when another shooter saw it and handed me an extra plug. Note to self: bring extra earplugs.
There weren't a ton of obstacles, but there was a lot of climbing up and down rough terrain. It was more running than obstacles, but there were enough obstacles and shooting stages to break up the running and give you a little break. The 5k started off with a low crawl under barbed wire and over rocks, up hill. That was....unpleasant. If you've ever done a Warrior Dash I would say the running and obstacles were about the same level of difficulty.
I ran with all my pistol and rifle mags in a chest rig, and my pistol holster on a CR Speed belt. Normally I like to have my mags on my belt since the reloads are a lot faster, but there weren't a lot of reloads on the clock so it wasn't as big of a consideration as in USPSA or multigun. I have a screwed up sciatic nerve and too much pressure on my left hip causes me a lot of pain, so I was worried about any extra weight bouncing around on my belt. The chest rig looked kind of mall ninja but it actually worked well for running since it held everything securely without any flopping or bouncing around. I also was happy with the VTAC padded sling I used. I was able to cinch it up nice and tight while running, then hit the quick release to extend it when it was time to shoot. The most important piece of equipment was my camelback, though. I took 3 liters along and used every drop.
We REALLY need to get something like this going in Nebraska.
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Good job dude!!
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{snip stuff that sounded like a blast--and thanks for giving so many details!}
We REALLY need to get something like this going in Nebraska.
I'd support that. And help work it!
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I've talked to Shea at 88Tactical about hosting something similar at his facility near Tekamah. He's interested but would need someone else to do all the organization. He also said that it would have to be in the winter when they aren't as busy. I'm happy to contribute but I just don't think I have the time to do all the organization and line up all the volunteers necessary.
I've also had preliminary discussions with the folks at Heartland Shooting Park. They were also open to the concept. Not sure if the location helps or hurts in terms of attendance and staffing.
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....and that competition looks like a TON of fun. Except for the running part. :)
What he said!
I suspect the mall ninja look worked pretty good for you. Now you you need to show up at ENGC and show off your skills for us mere (old) mortals :laugh:
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Except for the running and shooting, I think I would rock at this competition. Or at least I would look really cool at the bar afterwards.
Fly
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Anyone a member of the Old breed gun club? They have Take a in Bloomfield and "brainar?" I think. Anyways I shot with these guys at a DC precision shot out last summer. Decided to follow them on FB they do a lot of long range stuff but I think that this might be something that they would like. They already host a LR shoot maybe they would be willing to do a 5k if they got some additional help organizing.
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Here's a little video of some of the fun.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_9K41NDWQo (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_9K41NDWQo)
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Here's an idea, I'm not a shooting competition guy so someone else would need to head it up because I have no idea where to even start (but could have my arm twisted to do some trivial things that take no thought to help out), since it sounds like people would be interested in doing something like this, and there is people with ranges that also may be interested, why not get something like this started as an annual NFOA fundraiser.
People keep wanting to get Hornaday and Cabela's to support the NFOA, this is a way that the firearms industry would do things to support us by making prizes available, providing things etc. The NFOA could sell sponsorships (ie. we put up a banner with your company listed as a sponsor) and the funds raised through that pay for the event and prizes, then raffle incomes and registration fee's go to the NFOA (and any left over sponsorship dollars).
If someone has an idea how to set something like this up and its scheduled far enough out to get sponsors and advertise it as I said I will through in a hand just so it is not something technical.
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Here's an idea, I'm not a shooting competition guy so someone else would need to head it up because I have no idea where to even start (but could have my arm twisted to do some trivial things that take no thought to help out), since it sounds like people would be interested in doing something like this, and there is people with ranges that also may be interested, why not get something like this started as an annual NFOA fundraiser.
People keep wanting to get Hornaday and Cabela's to support the NFOA, this is a way that the firearms industry would do things to support us by making prizes available, providing things etc. The NFOA could sell sponsorships (ie. we put up a banner with your company listed as a sponsor) and the funds raised through that pay for the event and prizes, then raffle incomes and registration fee's go to the NFOA (and any left over sponsorship dollars).
If someone has an idea how to set something like this up and its scheduled far enough out to get sponsors and advertise it as I said I will through in a hand just so it is not something technical.
Agreed Allen but being involved in car shows for awhile it is building year over year. The planning for something like this might take over a year or better to get the logistics all set up. Getting set up with a club or range that already host these types of activities is almost must. Steel targets alone will cost a "fewish" thousand dollars if the NFOA or a group of individuals would try to start this. Then you get into a facility to handle such a thing. You need a lot of land or a bunch or good neighbors.
First step would be a committee to get a scope and some type of business plan I think.
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Agreed Allen but being involved in car shows for awhile it is building year over year. The planning for something like this might take over a year or better to get the logistics all set up. i
Agreed, that is why I said put far enough out to get it all together. If people come together to get it going when life happens to one of us we can all work together to keep the ball moving forward.
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I have no experience in organizing this sort of thing, but I'm more than willing to help out. Perhaps we should start a new thread to discuss it?
Trevor is right, something like this is most likely going to be something that grows year after year. I think the hardest thing is going to be finding enough volunteers. To run something like this safely you're going to need a minimum of 3 RO's per shooting stage, IMO. That's what they had in Pawnee and it went very smooth. One guy running the current shooter, one guy scoring, keeping organized, and taking times for runners arriving at the stage, and one guy to rotate in and give them a break. Then you'll need other event staff to help with overall scoring, roaming the course to make sure no one needs assistance, general logistics, etc.
Then you have to consider getting insurance to cover the event. An existing club or other organization who already has insurance is going to have a big head start there. I really like the idea of contacting Old Breed Gun Club. This seems like the kind of thing that would be up their alley.
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Agreed Allen but being involved in car shows for awhile it is building year over year. The planning for something like this might take over a year or better to get the logistics all set up. Getting set up with a club or range that already host these types of activities is almost must. Steel targets alone will cost a "fewish" thousand dollars if the NFOA or a group of individuals would try to start this. Then you get into a facility to handle such a thing. You need a lot of land or a bunch or good neighbors.
First step would be a committee to get a scope and some type of business plan I think.
You might be surprised, I think. For example, the Oklahoma Run and Gun match had (according to their stage descriptions) only the following targets for the entire match:
3 5" plates
4 paper plates
1 falling target
3 full-size torso targets
7 8" plates
4 12"x20" steel
dog target
head-sized plate
That's only 20 steel targets and some paper plates.
...I personally own rifle-rated steel (can take hits up to .308) and can buy paper plates :) sufficient to give targets of similar difficulty level other than 1: I don't have a dog target, and 2) I don't have a falling target.
....but I'm pretty sure I could manage a falling target (or borrow one) and I could find something interesting instead of a dog target to shoot. I'm betting John Wallace could say something similar, in terms of having targets sufficient for this. Heartland or ENGC already has WAY more in terms of equipment than this, and can be talked into letting you use them under many circumstances if you are at their range.
I've designed, built, staffed, and run the Zombie Match at ENGC for the last five years or so--while taking a year to set it up is handy, it can actually be done in less than that, including advertising and such. Given Practiscore these days, registration (even payment!), scoring, and reporting scores is a breeze.
The main problems you are going to have (in my opinion) are two things.
Problem 1: Staff. Getting people who know how to actually run shooters in an action setting (which this is) is very different from being an NRA RSO or running a precision rifle match. Not arguing about whether harder or easier, just saying it is DIFFERENT. Finding sufficient staff to make this work isn't easy. Certainly possible, but not easy. People who are good shooters or know rifles---isn't enough. Knowing how to run shooters in safety, how to run a stage and keep it moving and efficient, deal with problems--that's the kind of staff you need for this. The typical NRA RSO simply doesn't work with that kind of stuff.
Biggest problem: Range space.
Something like this either needs someone who owns a couple of square miles out in western Nebraska, or taking over the entire ENGC or Heartland range for a day.
...and it still wouldn't be easy at ENGC or Heartland, simply because the bays are too close together, and too easy to access. Certainly could be done there, but there would be a lot of "go run down this road around the loop and come back to the bay right next to this one" situations unless people get REALLY creative (which is possible).
...now you've got me thinking of how I would run this match at Heartland or ENGC. :o
Anyway---I think a match like this would be a TON of fun. I think that if you get someone who has run large matches before (preferably action ones), you'd be surprised and what it would take to make it work...
....IF you can get enough staff to run it, and a range space sufficient for it. (If you can get range space, I'm pretty sure we can collectively make the rest of it work.)
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You might be surprised, I think. For example, the Oklahoma Run and Gun match had (according to their stage descriptions) only the following targets for the entire match:
3 5" plates
4 paper plates
1 falling target
3 full-size torso targets
7 8" plates
4 12"x20" steel
dog target
head-sized plate
That's only 20 steel targets and some paper plates.
...I personally own rifle-rated steel (can take hits up to .308) and can buy paper plates :) sufficient to give targets of similar difficulty level other than 1: I don't have a dog target, and 2) I don't have a falling target.
....but I'm pretty sure I could manage a falling target (or borrow one) and I could find something interesting instead of a dog target to shoot. I'm betting John Wallace could say something similar, in terms of having targets sufficient for this. Heartland or ENGC already has WAY more in terms of equipment than this, and can be talked into letting you use them under many circumstances if you are at their range.
I've designed, built, staffed, and run the Zombie Match at ENGC for the last five years or so--while taking a year to set it up is handy, it can actually be done in less than that, including advertising and such. Given Practiscore these days, registration (even payment!), scoring, and reporting scores is a breeze.
The main problems you are going to have (in my opinion) are two things.
Problem 1: Staff. Getting people who know how to actually run shooters in an action setting (which this is) is very different from being an NRA RSO or running a precision rifle match. Not arguing about whether harder or easier, just saying it is DIFFERENT. Finding sufficient staff to make this work isn't easy. Certainly possible, but not easy. People who are good shooters or know rifles---isn't enough. Knowing how to run shooters in safety, how to run a stage and keep it moving and efficient, deal with problems--that's the kind of staff you need for this. The typical NRA RSO simply doesn't work with that kind of stuff.
Biggest problem: Range space.
Something like this either needs someone who owns a couple of square miles out in western Nebraska, or taking over the entire ENGC or Heartland range for a day.
...and it still wouldn't be easy at ENGC or Heartland, simply because the bays are too close together, and too easy to access. Certainly could be done there, but there would be a lot of "go run down this road around the loop and come back to the bay right next to this one" situations unless people get REALLY creative (which is possible).
...now you've got me thinking of how I would run this match at Heartland or ENGC. :o
Anyway---I think a match like this would be a TON of fun. I think that if you get someone who has run large matches before (preferably action ones), you'd be surprised and what it would take to make it work...
....IF you can get enough staff to run it, and a range space sufficient for it. (If you can get range space, I'm pretty sure we can collectively make the rest of it work.)
Show off [emoji12] .
I was thinking of places. Would if be possible to get a wild life management area? RockGlen easy of Fairberry could be great! 700 achers of rolling hills,
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Hell has, apparently, frozen over again. Thomas and I agree.
Not horribly expensive. I already have a potential headline sponsor that has agreed to make their facility available for a minimal day-use fee and a percentage of the take. As I mentioned, I also have had discussions with other locations. Twenty steel targets shouldn't push much past $1000 and I'm guessing that we might even be able to borrow steel targets from the host facility. One would assume that the insurance of the host facility would cover the event.
Difficult? Yes. Just like running this organization ... VOLUNTEERS will be the biggest challenge.
Promotion. Not terribly difficult or expensive.
I can lend my experience with obstacle races, adventure races and other similar events. But, again, Thomas is right. We would need someone who has run large matches. Although, I would recommend limiting participants to no more than 50 the first year - depending on the venue.
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Just curious what's the cost for these events?
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Entry fee was $75 per shooter.
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Difficult? Yes. Just like running this organization ... VOLUNTEERS will be the biggest challenge.
I, for one, would be willing to help out shleping things around or whatever needs to be done. This would be a fun event for everyone involved.
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I, for one, would be willing to help out shleping things around or whatever needs to be done. This would be a fun event for everyone involved.
Me too.
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I really like the idea of contacting Old Breed Gun Club. This seems like the kind of thing that would be up their alley.
Anyone have any contacts there? Their facility is three hours north of either Omaha or Lincoln but it looks like it would be well suited.
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I actually posted on there fb last night. Just to get a feeler. They said they are on private land up north. We need need to get permission from land owners in order to do it. They said they would be in to compete and maybe help out. But they would need more details. I said we were just kicking around the idea right now.
I think the best way to contact them is on Facebook. They are very active. They have a website but it isn't anything to great but I think they have a contact us page.
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I know several people, including myself, who would be happy to pay well more than $75 entry for a fun event such as this if it were somewhere in Nebraska. The one thing we are short of is time to travel to somewhere like Oklahoma for such an event. Time severely hampers my ability to volunteer, but I would gladly pay higher match fees to be able to attend unique events such as this.
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I actually posted on there fb last night. Just to get a feeler. They said they are on private land up north. We need need to get permission from land owners in order to do it. They said they would be in to compete and maybe help out. But they would need more details. I said we were just kicking around the idea right now.
I think the best way to contact them is on Facebook. They are very active. They have a website but it isn't anything to great but I think they have a contact us page.
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I sent them an e-mail through their Contact Us form.
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I'm going to start a new thread to discuss planning an event like this.