NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Laws and Legislation => Topic started by: itaintezbnrich on January 26, 2016, 07:06:15 PM
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I am 30 now. At 17 I was going through a rough patch in life and was put on a felony SIS probation in Missouri. For those who are unfamiliar: SIS stands for suspended imposition of sentence. How it was explained to me at the time was that if I successfully completed the probation the felony would not go on my record. How it worked out is that the felony is on my record, but is shown as not being a conviction.
I applied for a permit to purchase when I lived on the Iowa side and was denied. They were kind enough to show me the background check and it indeed said conviction: No. They asked me to produce a court document from Missouri stating my disposition. Well, I knew where that was going so I let it go.
I tried again last April after moving to Omaha and was denied. The letter stated that my "background check indicates that I was convicted" of said charges. I let this go as well. I am constantly doing research. I would do as much as possible, get tired of it and frustrated, move on, and then revisit after a few months.
Stars aligned after doing this for a while and I realized Federal law doesn't prohibit me from owning a firearm, and that the denial from Nebraska was for a handgun purchase (for obvious reasons, I didn't realize the check only encompassed handguns)
I still want to gain all rights I have available to me. My question is, should my next move be to reapply (I think after waiting a year) with Nebraska, and then appeal when its denied? Obviously the federal government doesn't consider me a felon as I was able to legally purchase a shotgun today from a FFL dealer after passing NICS.
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I would recommend seeking an attorneys advice...
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+1000 for consulting a lawyer. Do so ASAP and don't leave out any details including today's. Getting the cart before the horse on this could land you in deep doodoo again.
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Can you explain what about Nebraska law I should be worried about? I'm confused I will call one right away if there is any uncertainty.
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We advised you to consult a lawyer because your situation is too complicated for anyone but an experienced professional to analyze correctly. Unless you are an attorney yourself, you don't qualify and neither do we. Congratulations on putting your life back together after a serious mistake in your youth. Don't make another mistake, because you don't know what you are doing, that will leave you worse off than you were back then.
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This is why I don't agree with felons having their rights denied.
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Stars aligned after doing this for a while and I realized Federal law doesn't prohibit me from owning a firearm, and that the denial from Nebraska was for a handgun purchase (for obvious reasons, I didn't realize the check only encompassed handguns)I still want to gain all rights I have available to me.
If it is as you say then Federal law doesn't prohibit you from owning a firearm
BUT ! there is a big but in there That felony from Missouri is on your record as a conviction.
And you have done nothing to correct it! "bad bad bad" :o ???
My question is, should my next move be to reapply (I think after waiting a year) with Nebraska, and then appeal when its denied? Obviously the federal government doesn't consider me a felon as I was able to legally purchase a shotgun today from a FFL dealer after passing NICS.
Well Obviously a Part of the federal government doesn't consider you a felon.....
That and a buck fifty might get you a cup of coffee.
Right now until you get the above conviction corrected.
I would have nothing to do with Firearms (I mean Firearms of [any type]) or any ammunition for same.
Why ?
If you were to get stopped and a records check is run on you by any LLO
this might show up.......Legal or not legal isn't going to matter now.
And if your carrying a Firearm or Ammo they are MOST likely going to treat you and charge you.
the same as they would any other Felon in possession.
Now!....I'm not a lawyer.....but me thinks this most likely could or would get you several other Felony charges add to your record on top of that first mistake.
like others here have said you.
Need to get an attorneys advice.....QUICK!
The Government is never wrong and even if they are ... good luck!...cleaning up the mess that they might be the cause of.
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I will get to work. I know you guys know this - I wasnt intending on doing anything adverse to applicable laws. Merely trying to push forward in a fight for "rights".
I will lay low for now...
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Couldn't you just get your juvenile record sealed? Seems like the easiest way to handle the problem...
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Take the advice of those who told you to talk to a lawyer my friend. I had something on my record once that shouldn't have been there and caused a problem for me (not in regard to having a gun though) and all I had to do was write a letter to the governor and it was taken care of (after a few months). Mine was caused by an idiot bureaucrat doing something she had no business doing and I didn't even know about it until many years later when it caused a problem. Maybe your problem was caused by some bureaucrat not doing his job right and it can be fixed as easily as mine was, but none of us here know either the law or your situation well enough to tell you how to fix it. That's why we have lawyers. I know it sucks having to pay a lawyer to get a Constitutional right that was wrongly denied reinstated, but that's the world we live in.
This problem might end up causing some other problem down the road if you decide not to get it fixed, like maybe you can't get a job you want because of it. So I would spend the money and get it fixed.
Maybe someone here can give you the name of a good lawyer. I don't have one to give you or I would.
I agree with Mntnman that felons should have their 2nd Amendment rights reinstated after they do their time. If they are going to lose any rights for the rest of their life it would make infinitely more sense for them to lose their 4th and 5th Amendment rights. It should be either they lose them all or they lose none; otherwise it's treating the 2nd Amendment as a privilege rather than a right.
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State statue 69-2406 is the statue you want to look at. It deals with being denied a certificate and the process to appeal. Go to nebraskalegislature.gov on the left of the page you will see bills and laws go to search laws and put in 69-2406. If you weren't convicted then there is no state or fed law preventing you from obtaining a permit. Being charged is not the same as being convicted. But since you live in the peoples republic of Omaha that might be a different story. After a denial you have ten days to file an appeal with the county court and they have 30 days to get back to you. Did they tell you what city ordinance prevented you from obtaining a permit?
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The Kansas Asst. Attorney General explained to me, just because a person has a felony, doesn't necessarily ban them from gun ownership. Depends on the felony, and what state it happened in.
Thus the need for an attorney in this instance to unravel this.
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Update: I didn't rush anything. I waited a couple of years and obtained a background check from the FBI. From what was shown in that background check, I was able to write a letter to accompany my second attempt at applying for a Permit to Purchase. I subsequently received my Nebraska Permit to Purchase yesterday.
Thank you to everyone on this board who responded previously. Thanks goes to the defense attorney that gave me some advice free of charge. If anyone has any further concerns, please voice them. If anyone has any questions, feel free to post or DM.
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Update: I didn't rush anything. I waited a couple of years and obtained a background check from the FBI. From what was shown in that background check, I was able to write a letter to accompany my second attempt at applying for a Permit to Purchase. I subsequently received my Nebraska Permit to Purchase yesterday.
Thank you to everyone on this board who responded previously. Thanks goes to the defense attorney that gave me some advice free of charge. If anyone has any further concerns, please voice them. If anyone has any questions, feel free to post or DM.
ok, so you got your purchase permit. now what are you going to buy??
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ok, so you got your purchase permit. now what are you going to buy??
If I had been jumping through bureaucratic hoops for many years and suddenly had a purchase permit, I would buy ONE OF EVERYTHING.
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This is why I don't agree with felons having their rights denied.
I would concur, except for with violent offenders. Though I wouldn't be averse to there being a process for even them to reinstate their rights. In my opinion, if you've committed violence against another person, you've squandered your rights and proved yourself unworthy to possess them.
Update: I didn't rush anything. I waited a couple of years and obtained a background check from the FBI. From what was shown in that background check, I was able to write a letter to accompany my second attempt at applying for a Permit to Purchase. I subsequently received my Nebraska Permit to Purchase yesterday.
Thank you to everyone on this board who responded previously. Thanks goes to the defense attorney that gave me some advice free of charge. If anyone has any further concerns, please voice them. If anyone has any questions, feel free to post or DM.
Congratulations! It's always gratifying to hear of someone successfully fighting for their Constitutional rights.
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I would concur, except for with violent offenders. Though I wouldn't be averse to there being a process for even them to reinstate their rights. In my opinion, if you've committed violence against another person, you've squandered your rights and proved yourself unworthy to possess them.
I don't agree. If a dangerous person is going to use a weapon to commit another crime, breaking another law does nothing to prevent them from doing so. What happens is all of those who are no longer a threat are denied a basic, natural right unless they want to chance not getting caught. Once you have fulfilled your sentence (time and parole) you should be made whole. If you are enough of a threat to society, you should still be incarcerated. I personally know good people who got in trouble again unintentionally or been unable to continue their outdoor passions just because they have been made a felon.
Possession of any weapon alone should not be illegal. The 2A should be enough for that. Check this out:
Saw this while looking for something unrelated. Plain text interpretation of Bottolfson case? Hate legal speak.
"One must be careful when conceal carrying any type of knife in Nebraska, even if the blade is less than 3 ½ inches long. This is because in 2000, the Nebraska Supreme Court found, in State v. Bottolfson, that a knife with a blade less than 3 ½ inches long could still be a “dangerous instrument capable of inflicting cutting, stabbing, or tearing wounds” and therefore illegal to conceal carry. Whether any particular knife should be considered such a dangerous instrument is a question left to the jury at trial, which means that you could be arrested and tried for conceal carrying any knife with a blade less than 3 ½ inches long."
Look how easy your life could be ruined just because you have a tool in your pocket. I am not talking hypothetical, people are suffering because of laws that do more harm than good. When we allow exceptions to protecting our rights, we provide a path to the elimination of them.
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If you are enough of a threat to society, you should still be incarcerated.
While I can understand this mindset, I can't agree with it. How many times has the system failed and released a dangerous person back onto the streets too early? Our "justice" system is almost anything but.
Look how easy your life could be ruined just because you have a tool in your pocket. I am not talking hypothetical, people are suffering because of laws that do more harm than good. When we allow exceptions to protecting our rights, we provide a path to the elimination of them.
I'm right there with you, for the most part. I just take exception to those who have abused their freedoms and used them to violate the rights of others.
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Nikko Allen Jenkins is a reason not to restore Second Ammendment rights.
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Nikko Allen Jenkins is a reason not to restore Second Amendment rights.
I had to look him up, but you're right. He's a perfect example of why I don't put any faith in the "justice" system to keep the violent offenders in prison.
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Nikko Allen Jenkins is a reason not to restore Second Ammendment rights.
Thank you!
Perfect example of it totally being ineffective for what you think it’s needed for!
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Nikko Allen Jenkins is a reason not to restore Second Ammendment rights.
I also had to look him up, but now I'm confused. Wikipedia must have had the story wrong, because it said that all four of his victims had been shot. Did he have an accomplice they aren't mentioning? I just don't understand how he could have inflicted bullet wounds on them, since the government had stripped him of his 2A rights. Can someone who's better informed please explain this to me?
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I just don't understand how he could have inflicted bullet wounds on them, since the government had stripped him of his 2A rights. Can someone who's better informed please explain this to me?
I think the point was stripping people of their rights for any reason is idiotic because people who don't follow the law don't follow the law.
No amount of laws will keep bad guys from doing bad things or getting hold of guns. Many laws just hurt the general populace while being ignored by criminals, it's nearing impossible to remember and comply with all of them.
There should be no negotiation or limitation of 2a, period. Only: you do the crime, you do the time.
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I think the point was stripping people of their rights for any reason is idiotic because people who don't follow the law don't follow the law.
No amount of laws will keep bad guys from doing bad things or getting hold of guns. Many laws just hurt the general populace while being ignored by criminals, it's nearing impossible to remember and comply with all of them.
There should be no negotiation or limitation of 2a, period. Only: you do the crime, you do the time.
I'm with you there; above, I was feigning stupidity to make that exact point to SunsetSig, who didn't seem to have connected those dots yet. ;D