NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Laws and Legislation => Topic started by: Dalamar on March 29, 2018, 11:08:11 PM
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https://www.gunsamerica.com/blog/nebraska-supreme-court-redefines-concealed-carry-include-gun-vehicles-cab/
When's someone going to convince the RINOs to pass legislation allowing people who don't have a trunk to transport their guns to a range or hunting spot? Insane.
Personally I can't bring myself to pay the shakedown fee... Just to transport in a case or sleeve. I only carry in the woods!
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It doesn't matter what the law says when those who have no respect for the law have the power to put you in jail. Until American patriots are ready to rise up and hang the traitors who impose these illegal edicts on us, we will live under their rule.
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This is why LB666 would need to pass.
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This is also why we need to not retain any Supreme Court judge up for retention.
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Also, a good move would be to decriminalize the possession of weapons. Mere possession should be a protected right.
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Also, a good move would be to decriminalize the possession of weapons. Mere possession should be a protected right.
The 2A does that, but those who have impeached themselves by lying while taking the oath of office don't care. Maybe impeachment petitions for those who lied about "protecting and defending the Constitution from all enemies, both foreign and domestic, and I (they) take this OBLIGATION willingly, without purpose of evasion or mental reservations." by proposing and/or voting for laws which infringe any amendment?
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Even Chambers voted to move it out of committee so why has nothing happened since?
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Not quite. It's legal if you have the handgun inside a locked case. I don't remember whether it has to be unloaded, too.
You don't need to spend a fortune on a fancy, lockable, hard case. Sew some loops on your range bag and run a cable gun lock through them so that you can't get inside without opening the lock.
This became an issue after the Nebraska Supreme Court upheld the conviction of a man for illegal concealed carry. He had the gun inside an unlocked case jammed between the passenger seat and passenger door of his vehicle. I don't know whether the Court changed its interpretation of previously settled law or was sending a signal to the Legislature that they needed to correct the statute's wording.
This wasn't the first time someone was charged with illegal carry for having a handgun in an unlocked case. Something like 30 years ago, an Omaha private detective was charged with illegal concealed carry after police found a loaded .45 automatic in his briefcase. He was acquitted at trial probably on the affirmative defense that it was prudent for someone in his line of work to go armed.
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He was acquitted at trial probably on the affirmative defense that it was prudent for someone in his line of work to go armed.
Back at that time a provision in the NE Private Investigator Statue specifically allowed for PIs to carry a concealed handgun while actively working on a case.
As it happened, the statute did not further provide a definition for "working on a case." Kinda left the whole thing up in the air. But was probably sufficient to let PIs off the hook.
I happened to hold an NE PI license at one time, but never really felt sufficiently authorized to carry concealed as the law was then written.
sfg
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I don't remember whether it has to be unloaded, too.
The Federal statute for interstate transfer (which admittedly is NOT the NE State Statute, but serves as a general guideline) requires an unloaded handgun:
18USC926a
Notwithstanding any other provision of any law or any rule or regulation of a State or any political subdivision thereof, any person who is not otherwise prohibited by this chapter from transporting, shipping, or receiving a firearm shall be entitled to transport a firearm for any lawful purpose from any place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm to any other place where he may lawfully possess and carry such firearm if, during such transportation the firearm is unloaded, and neither the firearm nor any ammunition being transported is readily accessible or is directly accessible from the passenger compartment of such transporting vehicle: Provided, That in the case of a vehicle without a compartment separate from the driver’s compartment the firearm or ammunition shall be contained in a locked container other than the glove compartment or console.
Now: What's the definition of "unloaded?" I have heard that in Iowa, a loaded magazine in proximity is considered to create a loaded gun situation. But I don't really, actually know if such is true.
Sure have to be careful out there. Especially these days.
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This is a High School trap shooters worst nightmare.
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Koz............
Trapshooting is specificially mentioned in the Omaha Municode firearms transportation law:
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Sec. 20-195. - Possession or transportation of firearms.
(a) It shall be unlawful for any person to knowingly or purposely transport in any conveyance or in any other manner, or to possess off his own premises, any rifle, shotgun, air gun, air rifle, paint ball gun or machine gun unless the same is unloaded and contained in any enclosed gun case, or unloaded and broken down. The removal of the bolt from any such firearm or carrying the same in a holster type gun case without further breaking down such firearm shall not be deemed to be in compliance with the requirements of this section.
(b) The provisions of this section shall not be applicable to:
(1) Authorized law enforcement officers;
(2) The armed forces of the United States, including ROTC units and the National Guard in the performance of their duties;
(3) The carrying of unloaded and uncased rifles in parades or using rifles in ceremonials;
(4) The possession of rifles, machine guns, or shotguns at shows or exhibits; or
(5) Any other lawful use, purpose or activity, including but not limited to skeet and trap shooting, target shooting at rifle ranges, hunter safety instruction conducted by qualified instructors, when such do not endanger public safety or are detrimental to public welfare;
provided, however:
a. The prior approval of the police chief shall have been obtained for such use, purpose or activity; and
b. With respect to skeet and trap shooting ranges located or to be located in public parks, the final determination of the safety of the same shall be made by the city council.
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FYI,
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Is it still legal to transport loaded firearms in plain sight?
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Is it still legal to transport loaded firearms in plain sight?
I've seen news articles reference cases where it was still treated as concealed.
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Is it still legal to transport loaded firearms in plain sight?
Clearly, NOT long guns in Omaha.
Not an air rifle nor even a long paintball gun.
Can't even use a motorcycle-type scabbard.
Maybe elsewhere in this state.
FWIW,
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There is more to this story:
https://www.leagle.com/decision/inneco20160706375
https://www.thenewspaper.com/news/51/5109.asp
Do stupid things, win stupid prizes...unfortunately maybe for the rest of us too. I'm not happy about the precedent this sets...but I'm not exactly worried about it either. Probably needs more research.
It looks like he was found not guilty of the terroristic threats, attempted murder, etc...but they were just trying to nail him for anything and the concealed weapons charge was the best that they could do.
It also looks like he appealed it and was denied appeal, but to be honest my eyes glazed over from the walls of text from multiple articles I was scanning and I need to get to work, so I'll have to look later...if I remember.
By the way, this is incident happened three and a half years ago. The court ruling was in Dec, 2016.
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The Anaconda Squeeze.
A bit tighter each time you exhale.
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Ok, so I was the defense attorney on this case so I'll give you a rundown on what happened and what the issues were. The defendant was convicted of carrying a concealed weapon. The handgun was loaded in the manufacture's hardside case. He was driving a Uhaul and the case was placed basically as far away from him (he was driving) as was physically possible in the cab. Under the concealed carry statute, it doesn't matter if the firearm is loaded or unloaded so that's not the issue. Actually you can have an inoperable firearm and still be convicted for concealed carry.
The main issue was whether or not the firearm was located "on or about" his person. The case law in Nebraska previously said that it must be within the reach of the person to be considered "or about his person." But my guy was still convicted by a jury of carrying a concealed weapon even though I had the deputy that arrested him say that the handgun was not within his reach. The jury had found him not guilty of the other felony charges but I think they wanted to convict him of something so they hit him with the concealed weapon conviction.
So I appealed to the Nebraska Court of Appeals and successfully had the conviction overturned. The Attorney General's office appealed the Appellate Court's decision. The Supreme Court then reversed the Appellate Court and reinstated the original conviction. This decision basically overruled the prior case law regarding the concealed weapon having to be within reach of the person. This can be interpreted as the entire passenger compartment of a vehicle being "on or about his person".
The Nebraska Supreme Court is very pro prosecution so it's not a huge surprise that they would do this but what really sucked is that the attorney for the AG office appealed just to get clarification on an entirely different issue that was addressed by the appellate court and not on the concealed weapon conviction. But the Supreme Court ran with it anyway.
And an FYI, a CHP does not cover you with any weapon other than a handgun. Neb. Stat. 28-1202 specifically states "This section does not apply to a person who is the holder of a valid permit issued under the Concealed Handgun Permit Act if the concealed weapon the defendant is carrying is a handgun."
Most LE aren't going to arrest anyone for having their rifle in a case in the back of their SUV but under current case law, they could. I would rather not rely on an officer's discretion.
How LB 666 hasn't been passed yet is beyond me.
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Ok, so I was the defense attorney on this case.........
Happy Day.
We here on the Forum need much more of this firsthand kind of input from legal professionals.
Because.... firearms law is entirely arcane and its application by law enforcement and the courts is even worse.
Here we have both a US-Federal Constitution and a Nebraska State Constitution which assert that "...the right to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed." Yet that basic right is continually infringed upon, ignored, set aside, yada-yada, to our peril.
Compare constitutional RKBA to the rights associated with free speech. Tread on free speech, then 100,000 voices from all parts of the media will shout and scream loud in protest. Tread on the RKBA, and the same 100,000 media voices will scream, but they are screaming in approval. Many voices in the legal realm will join them (cf: Omaha City Council, et.al.)
Thanks, Immortality, for sharing your expertise and special insights.
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Wow that's really bad, not even rifles covered, need to keep the pressure up on politicians to pass LB666 this year.
imo the supreme court justices involved should be in jail.
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Immortality,
Care to speculate how this case would have been adjudicated had the firearm been openly displayed, and by that I refer to the Nebraska provision that states a handgun is not concealed if any part of it is capable of being seen
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And an FYI, a CHP does not cover you with any weapon other than a handgun. Neb. Stat. 28-1202 specifically states "This section does not apply to a person who is the holder of a valid permit issued under the Concealed Handgun Permit Act if the concealed weapon the defendant is carrying is a handgun."
One of the reasons I built an AR15 pistol was to have a firearm covered by my CHP when traveling in an SUV or other vehicle with no locking trunk area
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I had no idea that my CHP wouldn't be applicable to long guns in the cab :o
thank you for this information
And an FYI, a CHP does not cover you with any weapon other than a handgun. Neb. Stat. 28-1202 specifically states "This section does not apply to a person who is the holder of a valid permit issued under the Concealed Handgun Permit Act if the concealed weapon the defendant is carrying is a handgun."
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One of the reasons I built an AR15 pistol was to have a firearm covered by my CHP when traveling in an SUV or other vehicle with no locking trunk area
One thing that I have considered is walking your own land with an AR pistol during the deer season without a valid deer permit. You would be legal but it would blow to have to go to court to prove it. Our CO is pretty chill but during deer season they seem to move COs around to patrol "strangers".
Another possible problem would be having a pistol during deer season that met the threshold of legal power for the taking of big game and holding more than 6 rounds while mentoring youth hunters with their hunt. I think you could get in trouble if the wrong person contacted you. You could not rely on the judiciary for "common sense.".
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Wow that's really bad, not even rifles covered, need to keep the pressure up on politicians to pass LB666 this year.
imo the supreme court justices involved should be in jail.
The Justice that wrote the opinion just resigned as a result of allegations of... well I guess you could say he was a "me too" movement casualty.
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I had no idea that my CHP wouldn't be applicable to long guns in the cab :o
thank you for this information
Technically, the set of steak knives you just bought and are still the in Target bag in the back of your wife's SUV could be considered a concealed weapon on or about your person.... The list of possible abuses are pretty long. Again, most LE aren't going to hit you for it unless you're doing something else wrong but I don't like letting them make that call.