NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Newsworthy => Topic started by: tstuart34 on May 28, 2014, 10:09:31 AM
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My son is/was a first grader at Kooser Elementry School. My wife over the weekend showed me this e-mail that the principle sent out. I couldn't find anything on the Journal Stars website about this but I thought I should post the letter the LPS sent out. I had no idea about this until she told me about it.
Dear Kooser families,
I would like to inform you of an incident that occurred after school today while parents were picking up their students. Parents observed a firearm inside of a vehicle on school grounds and immediately notified the police. The police then notified school personnel. An investigation determined an off-duty law enforcement official brought the weapon in his car onto school grounds, but posed no threat to students, staff or parents. This incident will be investigated and processed by law enforcement.
A reminder: LPS policy states that only on-duty peace officers and those contracted for school security may possess firearms on school property.
If you have any questions or concerns, feel free contact me.
Sincerely,
Ann Jablonski
Kooser Principal
As a parent I am not mad at the officer. Though I think he is a idiot for not know the law that he is to be upholding and if he did have his firearm on him why he ever made it visible to anyone is beyond me. My real issue with the whole situation is with LPS policy. Why are off duty PD not allowed to carry on school grounds? It is there sworn job to protect us and uphold the law (which he didn't). Why must they be contracted as security to be allowed to carry there weapons?
I am a huge supporter of armed security with in the schools. When I walk into my sons school though a unlocked door to have the first person I might is a frail almost retired women does not make me feel the best about our children safety. After her you have a office filled with a group of very nice and caring group of ladies in the office. Past that you have free range to the entire school. I have never seen any other type of security within the school outside of administrators. I am not looking for a ex Navy Seal in full battle gear sitting at the front desk..... well maybe I am.... :D
I have been out of school for 7 years now... but when I was at Northstar High School the campus security was compiled of the Head Baseball Coach, Head Softball Coach, and the Head Wrestling Coach. Though Northstar was not the worse school in Lincoln the first few years we had a lot of kids that had been kicked out of ever other school in Lincoln and some local gangs tried moving into the schools. I will admit the administration was very proactive about removing the problems but that doesn't solve the problem of the school using security as a way to hire coaches.
LPD does have recourses officers assigned to schools. But often they are not at the schools since they are responsible for multiple locations. They often sit at the high schools which is good but wouldn't it be better if you had a staff of first responders able to defend themselves and others if the needed?
So this was more of a rant for me then anything... I am not sure how much since I made through all of that but what will it take for LPS and other Nebraska school districts to realize that they have major weakness and should revaluate?
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Security at my daughter's school is a joke. The main entrance is guarded by a receptionist behind a desk, and the side doors are routinely opened to let people in.
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And still ..... nobody died.....
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Parents observed a firearm inside of a vehicle on school grounds and immediately notified the police
Huh? I can legally take a handgun on school property as long as I have a valid CHP and it never leaves the vehicle. So, the mere presence of a firearm in a vehicle parked in a school parking lot is not necessarily a violation of the law
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Huh? I can legally take a handgun on school property as long as I have a valid CHP and it never leaves the vehicle. So, the mere presence of a firearm in a vehicle parked in a school parking lot is not necessarily a violation of the law
Not Necessarily?
I will admit I did not know this. I thought it was no guns anywhere... So the officer was not out of line but should of been more discreet on where he stored the gun in the vehicle.
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"Not necessarily" because there is no mention of the off duty LPD officer having a valid CHP
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"Not necessarily" because there is no mention of the off duty LPD officer having a valid CHP
In accordance with the Law Enforcement Safety Act of 2004, current and retired LEO's do not have to have a CHP to carry a concealed handgun, and it's valid nation-wide.
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n accordance with the Law Enforcement Safety Act of 2004, current and retired LEO's do not have to have a CHP to carry a concealed handgun, and it's valid nation-wide.
They must, however, comply with that State's CC laws .....
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In accordance with the Law Enforcement Safety Act of 2004, current and retired LEO's do not have to have a CHP to carry a concealed handgun, and it's valid nation-wide.
Which, oddly enough, doesn't actually give them the same rights as someone who has a NE CCW permit, reading the law directly. :/
LEOSA actually doesn't override the Gun-Free School Zone act, so the school area is actually a specific space in which LEOSA doesn't hold for off-duty/retired LEOs. "Although the GFSZA authorizes on-duty law enforcement officers to carry firearms in such circumstances, off-duty and retired law enforcement officers are still restricted from doing so unless they have a firearms license issued from the state in which they reside and then it is only good for the state in which they reside."
Much as I detest citing Wikipedia, the discussion there is actually clear and concise, and correct as far as I can tell.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_Enforcement_Officers_Safety_Act (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_Enforcement_Officers_Safety_Act)
(Unless there has been an update to the law I don't know about.)
As such, 28-1204.04 is the applicable law, and unless either section f or section h applies, then having the firearm wasn't legal. (The fact that the firearm was in view makes me think that neither was actually applicable, unless it was a long gun in a locked rack, which I suppose might have happened...?)
http://nebraskalegislature.gov/laws/statutes.php?statute=s2812004004 (http://nebraskalegislature.gov/laws/statutes.php?statute=s2812004004)
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The off duty LPD officer's firearm, by law, should have been confiscated if it was not legally possessed on school grounds.
(2) Any firearm possessed in violation of subsection (1) of this section shall be confiscated without warrant by a peace officer or may be confiscated without warrant by school administrative or teaching personnel. Any firearm confiscated by school administrative or teaching personnel shall be delivered to a peace officer as soon as practicable.
(3) Any firearm confiscated by or given to a peace officer pursuant to subsection (2) of this section shall be declared a common nuisance and shall be held by the peace officer prior to his or her delivery of the firearm to the property division of the law enforcement agency which employs the peace officer. The property division of such law enforcement agency shall hold such firearm for as long as the firearm is needed as evidence. After the firearm is no longer needed as evidence, it shall be destroyed in such manner as the court may direct.
(4) Whenever a firearm is confiscated and held pursuant to this section or section 28-1204.02, the peace officer who received such firearm shall cause to be filed within ten days after the confiscation a petition for destruction of such firearm. The petition shall be filed in the district court of the county in which the confiscation is made. The petition shall describe the firearm held, state the name of the owner, if known, allege the essential elements of the violation which caused the confiscation, and conclude with a prayer for disposition and destruction in such manner as the court may direct. At any time after the confiscation of the firearm and prior to court disposition, the owner of the firearm seized may petition the district court of the county in which the confiscation was made for possession of the firearm. The court shall release the firearm to such owner only if the claim of ownership can reasonably be shown to be true and either (a) the owner of the firearm can show that the firearm was taken from his or her property or place of business unlawfully or without the knowledge and consent of the owner and that such property or place of business is different from that of the person from whom the firearm was confiscated or (b) the owner of the firearm is acquitted of the charge of unlawful possession of a handgun in violation of section 28-1204, unlawful transfer of a firearm to a juvenile, or unlawful possession of a firearm at a school. No firearm having significant antique value or historical significance as determined by the Nebraska State Historical Society shall be destroyed. If a firearm has significant antique value or historical significance, it shall be sold at auction and the proceeds shall be remitted to the State Treasurer for distribution in accordance with Article VII, section 5, of the Constitution of Nebraska.
So. which is it? a legally possessed firearm? Or a miscarriage of justice? If the firearm was not legally possessed, then it should have been confiscated and scheduled for destruction in accordance with the law...zero tolerance and all considered.
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They must, however, comply with that State's CC laws .....
Only some of them, apparently. A twist to it that I didn't know before this thread made me read about it more in-depth.
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Doesn't the law applicable to a CHP holder require that a handgun, if left in a vehicle, be locked in a glovebox, lockbox, etc? Regardless of whether the vehicle is locked.
Fly
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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In reviewing the letter from the Principal, one Ann Jablonski (who I bet hates guns...but that is my adulterated opinion), there is no mention if 1) the LEO is LPD (or what department, agency or office) and 2) if said "firearm" was a handgun, rifle or shotgun.
That being said, I am with Dan W.... if indeed the above occurred it is my hope that said LEO's "firearm" is confiscated per the law
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Dan,
I believe the statute requires that you have the gun locked up before exiting the vehicle if you are parking on the premises of a prohibited place.
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Dan,
I believe the statute requires that you have the gun locked up before exiting the vehicle if you are parking on the premises of a prohibited place.
Agreed, assuming he was outside his vehicle when the aforementioned firearm was in view, and that the rule only applies to a valid CHP holder
I seem to recall a case from a few years back in Omaha where a fella had some long guns in his pickup, no chp. He was involved in some sort of altercation in a parking lot that was used by a school. If I recall correctly he was found to be legally transporting the long guns and not charged with having a gun on school property. May not be relevant, but I thought it was sorta on topic
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Doesn't the law applicable to a CHP holder require that a handgun, if left in a vehicle, be locked in a glovebox, lockbox, etc? Regardless of whether the vehicle is locked.
Fly
Yep, but again only applies to a valid CHP holder
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Yep, but again only applies to a valid CHP holder
Yes, but the statute itself also includes an exemption for non-CHP holders, too:
"(f) firearms contained within a private vehicle operated by a nonstudent adult which are not loaded and (i) are encased or (ii) are in a locked firearm rack that is on a motor vehicle,"
http://nebraskalegislature.gov/laws/statutes.php?statute=s2812004004 (http://nebraskalegislature.gov/laws/statutes.php?statute=s2812004004)
The CHP holder exemption is similar:
"(h) a handgun carried as a concealed handgun by a valid holder of a permit issued under the Concealed Handgun Permit Act in a vehicle or on his or her person while riding in or on a vehicle into or onto any parking area, which is open to the public and used by a school if, prior to exiting the vehicle, the handgun is locked inside the glove box, trunk, or other compartment of the vehicle, a storage box securely attached to the vehicle, or, if the vehicle is a motorcycle, a hardened compartment securely attached to the motorcycle while the vehicle is in or on such parking area, except as prohibited by federal law."
So even without a CCW permit, he COULD still have been okay if the gun was unloaded and in a locked rack (which would be the only way I could think of for him to be legal but still have the gun in view).
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They must, however, comply with that State's CC laws .....
Actually the "national cop carry" except off duty and retired cops from state carry laws. It does not however exempt them from federal law which is the domain of gun free schools.
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BlackheartPaladin.... you would be incorrect. Reference synopsis at below link (specifically the very first sentence)
http://le.nra.org/leosa.aspx (http://le.nra.org/leosa.aspx)
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I'm just basing it off the lawyer who talked to us about it.
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And you don't have to abide by state law. Otherwise off duty cops wouldn't be able to take their guns into bars churches etc.
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Sounds like y'all need a new lawyer to come and speak.....the language is pretty clear .....
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In my opinion, the letter turned a NON issue/NON event into an issue and was poor judgment on the part of school officials to ever send it out..............one more example of the failure of "Zero tolerance" policies
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Any person who possesses a firearm in a school, on school grounds, in a school-owned vehicle, or at a school-sponsored activity or athletic event is guilty of the offense of unlawful possession of a firearm at a school. Unlawful possession of a firearm at a school is a Class IV felony. This subsection shall not apply to the issuance of firearms to or possession by members of the armed forces of the United States, active or reserve, National Guard of this state, or Reserve Officers Training Corps or peace officers or other duly authorized law enforcement officers when on duty or training,
What this says is that a Peace Officer with an issued or authorized firearm is exempt.
What it also says is that OTHER duly authorized law enforcement officers must be on duty or training.
Read it like this; Shall not apply to the issuance of firearms to or possession by peace officers.
If you read it using only one category at a time you should understand what I am saying. The use of the OR's simply replaces comma's.
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In my opinion, the letter turned a NON issue/NON event into an issue and was poor judgment on the part of school officials to ever send it out..............one more example of the failure of "Zero tolerance" policies
Definitely a failure, unless you take into account there is a large number of hold hands and sing Kumbya liberals in the public education system that think even Peace Officers should not be allowed to carry guns.
Whether it is a ccw or cop the headlines are always; My cousin sang in the church choir, that cop didn't have to shoot him just because he trying to run him down with a stolen car or Just because he was robbin' the place with a gun there was no need for that pig to shoot my baby etc......
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My point on LEOSA applied to each individual state's statutes i.e. the off duty or retired LEO is compelled to obey whatever said state's CHP/firearms laws....it is not a blanket coverage any place any time. IMHO and limiting to only the topic of LEOs .... retired or off duty they SHOULD be allowed to carry with no exceptions and STUPID not to.....
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My point on LEOSA applied to each individual state's statutes i.e. the off duty or retired LEO is compelled to obey whatever said state's CHP/firearms laws....it is not a blanket coverage any place any time. IMHO and limiting to only the topic of LEOs .... retired or off duty they SHOULD be allowed to carry with no exceptions and STUPID not to.....
I am not going to discuss any legalities with you guys because almost everything you are saying is a learning experience for me. But I agree with you bullit.
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I'm just basing it off the lawyer who talked to us about it.
I would recommend having your lawyer review the law again, and ask for my money back if I spent any on that discussion. Bullit gave correct information, there was a bill about off duty law enforcement having firearms on school grounds this year in the Legislature but I believe Ernie killed it.