NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Newsworthy => Topic started by: NE Bull on September 29, 2014, 02:46:51 PM
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https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=635264519927204&set=a.284483481671978.70434.100003309867796&type=1 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=635264519927204&set=a.284483481671978.70434.100003309867796&type=1)
This going around on FB (not sure if there is a article elsewhere) posted from the LIBA President's page. ( I Googled it and only find some paranoid postings to the Market's FB page)
I think many of us may recognize this young lady???
While I'm still on the fence with the mass OC groups, the individual simply going about their day, carrying their choice of SD in the manner in which they see fit? --- KUDOS
(p.s. many folks are following a thread in which the board for the Market are to review their policies in regards to safety at their venue. As your representative, I let them know the nearly 8000 members of the NFOA are also following this decision. )
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At the Market? Oh my! Produce could get hurt!
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I gave em a piece of my mind
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*Sigh*
Yes, that's me. And if I had known my photo would be posted online and shared, I would have brushed my hair.
I admit, I feel so much better after reading the supportive posts. I was just buying cheese at the same market I've carried at for the last three years. Didn't mean to cause trouble. :-X
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I gave em a piece of my mind
Yes you did- twice even. ;)
But you used facts and stuff- they won't understand.
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*Sigh*
Yes, that's me. And if I had known my photo would be posted online and shared, I would have brushed my hair.
I admit, I feel so much better after reading the supportive posts. I was just buying cheese at the same market I've carried at for the last three years. Didn't mean to cause trouble. :-X
I know'd it was you!
LOL yeah, my first thought was, man that girl really let her hair go! Musta just woke up? ;)
Seriously, though, I appreciate the positive manner which you carry yourself when carrying.
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Good for you MissMichella.
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Hahaha. I look a little like the girl from "The Grudge." It's a good reminder for me since OCers are scrutinized out and about.
Here's a copy of the email the Farmer's Market sent me after I emailed them regarding the picture posted all over their Facebook page.
Hi Michelle,
Thanks for sending me a message. I took down the photo of you posted to our Facebook page out of respect and to also help diffuse any further politicizing on the issue while we consider what to do as a board. I think we'd appreciate your thoughts on the matter. The best way to pass that along to the board would be via email. You may either send an email to me at ocrfm.manager@gmail.com or to our board president Kevin Loth at kevinloth@aol.com. Please cc me if you email Kevin directly, he doesn't check or respond to email as frequently as I do. I am hoping to have something resolved by Market on Sunday, so the sooner the better. Thanks, Megan OCRFM Market Manager (402)309-9096
If anyone wants to send some emails out, it would be great to get our voices heard.
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This is what we need more of. Two thumbs way up. The Blackhawk Serpa, same holster I've been CC my G23 in recently. I wish I had your courage, then I wouldn't have to wear shirts 2 times to big.
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Proud of you MM - I find it amusing that you are making some of the anti's heads explode with your photo.
They want to associate all gun owners as giant bucktoothed bubbas locked and loaded up with army pants, a bowie knife and a couple ak's strapped on their back.
An attractive young lady carrying has to make the anti's not know what to think! You could be their daughter, their nurse, their bank teller, their childs school teacher, or their baby sitter! You definitely put the American gun owner in a positive light. Thank you for taking a stand! You make the rest of us bucktoothed bubbas look a little better today.
66bigblock
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I sent them an email asking them not to make their market a unarmed victim zone. Everyone should do the same.
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My reply:
" The empowered woman who was spotted open carrying at the farmers market is a beacon of light for other women. She chooses to protect herself and not rely on others, is extremely polite, will answer any legitimate question you have about gun rights, and is not intimidating at all. She is a true ambassador for respectful law-abiding citizens.
Don't freak out at the sight of a responsible person who is armed. Freak out about the criminal who is illegally carrying and could hurt you without you having any way to protect yourself... oh and by the way, your anti-gun antics just deprived someone else of legally being able to defend themselves, or even you."
Good work MM
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Ugh! Shame on me for falling into a debate on FB with strangers who are very anti-gun, oh but wait they grew up around guns and can shoot straight! Ugh!
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My two cents ..... MissMichella et al. I think the "argument" needs to be re-framed. The last I read the U.S. Constitution, the First Amendment gives Ms. Amanda Gailey the RIGHT to post in writing and verbally her OPINION on carrying of firearms .... and I am all FOR it. That being said, she and the OCFM need only read down the page to the Second Amendment which we all know was put there to prevent the infringing of our RIGHT to carry/own a firearm.
FURTHERMORE, I would address Mrs. Gailey's "hysterics" regarding qualifications, training, etc with this..... there is NOTHING that REQUIRES or even alludes to her comments for carrying/owning... just as there are no qualifiers for her to speak FREELY as she so does .....
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Proud of you MM - I find it amusing that you are making some of the anti's heads explode with your photo.
They want to associate all gun owners as giant bucktoothed bubbas locked and loaded up with army pants, a bowie knife and a couple ak's strapped on their back.
An attractive young lady carrying has to make the anti's not know what to think! You could be their daughter, their nurse, their bank teller, their childs school teacher, or their baby sitter! You definitely put the American gun owner in a positive light. Thank you for taking a stand! You make the rest of us bucktoothed bubbas look a little better today.
66bigblock
+ 1000, bigblock writes a lot better than I do. But I'm also very proud of you Miss M.
When I was first starting to read the thread, even before getting to MM's post, asked myself if it could be Miss M?
Haven't read the facebook flap, but if I saw you in public, I would say glad your taking care of business.
Your ROCK Miss M.
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before i took the time to really look at this, i thought it was an article printed somewhere, just at first glance.
i believe i'd be thoroughly pissed if someone, somewhere, snapped a random photo of me, and then started posting it all over facebook, and God knows where else...
seriously, this doesn't violate some form of privacy laws?
these people that do these sort of things, and think it is fine are solely mistaken.
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As far as i know, no privacy laws were broken, its a public space. I posted one thing, but those comments.... some are silly and some are downright hypocrisy. No one has applauded her for being a strong independent woman, ecxept for us.
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i believe i'd be thoroughly pissed if someone, somewhere, snapped a random photo of me, and then started posting it all over facebook, and God knows where else...
seriously, this doesn't violate some form of privacy laws?
Nope. Appearing in public negates any expectation of privacy. As such, as long as the person who is using the picture is not receiving money for its use, they can take pictures and post them all they like. (If they receive money for it, then permission gets murkier depending on the circumstances.)
This is also why it is legal to record video of police officers in public, and post those videos publicly, by the way. (In most states, that is.)
Reading some of the comments on the market page, we again see that a significant section of the vocal public values emotionalism and scare tactics as opposed to reason and fact. Also, that most people 1) don't know anything about crime and violence, and 2) assume that it is other people's job to take care of them.
[sigh]
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I think we need to formulate a letter to the farmers market directors and point out that a representative from Nebraskans Against Gun Violence went all activist at the sight of a 110lb woman respectively and legally opening carrying a retention holstered handgun as non intimidating as one possibility could. have them ask themselves how this activism on her part "reduces gun violence" in nebraska as her group's goal states, or does it just restrict that person legal right to do that. I just ran some numbers and outside of North Omaha Nebraska has a total homicide rate of less than 0.8 per 100,000! That puts us in the top 20 safest nations in the entire world. when was the last time that NAGV went into north Omaha and worked with community outreach and actually tried to help reduce the violence there? If they truly cared about reducing gun violence then they would focus on where the problem is and not trying to strip away an empowered woman's right to self defense in the legal manner of her choosing. She's worried about MM carrying legally and respectfully and worried that some "gun nut" is going to shoot up the joint. My next question is this, if some "nut" were going to shoot up the place do you think it makes a difference to the rest of the crowd in the manner of which a person carries? They're defenseless already, so it doesn't make any difference to them. Heck, her open carrying at least allows them to see the firearm.
No rudabagas were harmed in the crafting of this message.
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slightly off this topic, but related.
On one of the FB pages regarding the Old Cheney FM, someone refrenced the Haymarket FM as being no guns allowed. I cant find the post now, and I have searched the Haymarket website and FB page. Can anyone clarify for me? I cant see how a public street could be posted as no guns allowed, but in this town, who knows...
thanks,
66bigblock
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You guys are awesome. I'm so grateful and proud to be a part of the NFOA. The support is so appreciated, especially due to some of the comments being thrown around. I just went to buy a bag of cheese. Didn't expect to start this..
I've OCed at that Farmer's Market for three seasons now with no problems until now. While it was mortifying to find out my photo was posted without my consent, it's great to live in a country where people can use their 1st Amendment Rights to discuss my 2nd Amendment Rights, eh?
I find it interesting how few people know about the violence that does take place in Lincoln. I also find it interesting how many of the antis are reverting to name-calling..."nut" or "fearful woman." If they thought I really was a crazy nut, then why are they deliberately trying to provoke a "nut" on a public forum with their names, jobs, and locations visible? Does not seem very logical. I think those of us who carry aren't afraid...but some people apparently are by the presence of a firearm.
Thank you all so much for the support. Hopefully, when faced by facts, the OCFM board will side with Nebraska State Law and Federal Law.
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Stick to your "guns" M.M.
I to am proud of you, don't let these negative do gooders change what you feel is right.
Greg58
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We've got your back, MM ... regardless of whether or not you brush your hair. ;-)
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I've OCed at that Farmer's Market for three seasons now with no problems until now.
THIS is a fact I keep trying to drive home- WHY NOW? Obviously none of the purveyors had a problem with ya.
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This is awesome. It must have Lincoln's tiny little tie-dyed, weed-smoking population totally befuddled because it reflects the reality of modern gun ownership rather than their stereotypes.
They must also have their panties in a bunch that it happened at a 'farmers market'. For some reason, at some point, the idea of fresh produce, meat and cheese got commandeered by the tie-dyed crowd. Those of us who grew up on actual farms and living off that stuff our whole lives suddenly found ourselves surrounded by people who thought that wanting to buy fresh sweet corn and zucchini somehow equated to wanting to listen to some guy play the lute while panhandling for change, or wanting to hear about how there are no more monarch butterflies left.
PS... Has anyone else noted that there are a zillion monarch butterflies around this year??
PPS... By golly, MM, I have a pair of denim shorts exactly like that!
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PPS... By golly, MM, I have a pair of denim shorts exactly like that!
Oh my! That's a vision I didn't not need to have.
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My latest reply:
"Nebraska has a gun ownership rate around 40%, yet outside of North Omaha has a total overall homicide rate from every method of less than 0.8 per 100,000. That puts us in comparison with the safest top 16 nations in the world. Maybe the Nebraskans Against Gun Violence organization should focus on where the problem is and work with all sides to stop violence in general that is perpetuated through gangs, drugs, environment and poverty. When was the last time they spearheaded a community outreach in north Omaha instead of trying to restrict a peaceful law abiding woman from lawfully carrying a firearm for her own protection. You speak of statistics, and I gave you some. You speak of Omaha's training requirements, yet they account for over 80% of all the murders in Nebraska."
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Did anyone catch the KFOR 1240 interview tonight with the Nebraskan's Against Gun Violence volunteer?
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...and not only will I comb my hair, I will also retire those shorts... :laugh:
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Did anyone catch the KFOR 1240 interview tonight with the Nebraskan's Against Gun Violence volunteer?
No. Please fill us in.
Sent from my C771 using Tapatalk 2
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http://www.kfor1240.com/The-Coby-Mach-Show/17550824 (http://www.kfor1240.com/The-Coby-Mach-Show/17550824)
Second one down.
I'm against gun violence too...that's why I carry.
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Ignorance is strong with Amanda Gailey.
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http://www.kfor1240.com/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=6983483 (http://www.kfor1240.com/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=6983483)
http://www.kfor1240.com/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=6982399 (http://www.kfor1240.com/play_window.php?audioType=Episode&audioId=6982399)
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I read somewhere that....."A gun is like a parachute, if you need it and don't have it, you'll never need it again"
Carry on Miss Michella :D
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The only real purpose for the 2nd Amendment is to overthrow a government which has morphed into an oppressor of people and their rights. The 2nd Amendment will give the people a chance to restore freedom. If they fail, there will be no other chances.
Quite simply, those who would eliminate the 2nd Amendment are NOT concerned with deaths because cars and medical malpractice kill more people than guns. They are not even against their own use of firearms to protect themselves, even though they would deny that right to others. They are concerned that those who would resist their attempts to replace the rule of law under the constitution with socialism would use firearms as a last resort when the law and the ballot box fail.
If firearms become necessary around the country, and not just locally, then the country as a free nation no longer exists and what follows will be a fight for survival.
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I'm against gun violence too...that's why I carry.
My response to the group, exactly.
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I made the mistake of trying to logically engage people who were posting in that thread. I gave up. I finally had to block two of the people because I could not stand to read their contradictory comments any longer. These people kept posting "a well regulated militia" without adding any other part of the 2A. *sigh. It is frustrating and I just don't have the patience.
There were others who posted opposing views to my comments that also did not make any sense. Such as, if the woman who was beheaded in OK had been carrying a gun, would that have stopped her from "losing her head" (his words).
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i just sent the farmer's markets people an email. has anyone heard from them yet?
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My email:
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Megan,
I'm 73 and have been retired for six years. Because of my degrees and certifications to teach Physics, Math, Chemistry, Biology and Earth Sciences, while I was teaching at York College, I was asked by the York County Attorney in 1987 to examine evidence from a murder that took place earlier at Henderson, NE. Sydney Thieszen, a 14 year old adopted boy, shot and killed Sasha Thieszen, a 12 year old girl who was also adopted by the Thieszen family.
Sydney's attorney was asking for 3rd Degree accidental homicide. From the blood evidence collected at the time I was able to prove that Sydney had molested Sasha after he had killed her. After this fact established that covering up an attempted sexual assault was the motive for the murder, Sydney's attorney agreed to a plea bargain of 2nd degree murder. Sydney was given a 40 year sentence without parole.
That's the end of it, right? Wrong!
If things had taken their normal course Sydney Thieszen might not have seen freedom till 2027. However, because of a ruling in 1997 by a Nebraska Supreme Court Justice, all 2nd degree murder convections were thrown out, giving Sydney the option of a new trial. His jail house "lawyers" advised him to seek a re-trial because since his first trial some investigators had retired, moved or died, and that the evidence against him was probably lost or destroyed. His buddies were wrong. I kept the evidence in my custody under lock and key the entire time. I testified at the second trial. So did two psychiatrists, who testified that Sydney was too psychotic to ever be released from prison. If you knew Sydney's history from birth till he and his mother were arrested you'd understand why he is such a warped individual. The jury which heard the evidence found him guilty and recommended a life sentence with no possibility of parole. Sydney Thieszen was 24 at the time of the second trial.
That's the end of it, right? Wrong.
Fast forward 15 years later, to November of 2012, when I received an email from the secretary of the Nebraska Board of Pardons informing me that due to a ruling early that summer by the United States Supreme Court all sentences of life in prison without parole handed out to juvenile offenders were declared unconstitutional. Five different "social justice" organizations had been working together for several years for this result and they had gotten their wish. Since then, the fate of more than two dozen juvenile murderers have been up in the air, a political football, batted back and forth. One camp wants their sentences commuted for time served. Another wants to allow them to be paroled for time served. Another wants them to remain in prison a minimum of 40 years and then be eligible for parole. And so on.
For most of my first forty years I used to be an avid hunter and fisherman, but when I started my consulting business in 1980 I had no time to pursue those interests and never shot a gun or bow, or cast a bait. Since Sydney Thieszen has been heard to say that if he ever gets released he would kill his entire family I, for one, took his threat seriously and saw no reason to assume that he wouldn't target me or my family as well, since my testimony aided in his conviction. So, in the months following that Board of Pardons email I took the necessary classes and qualified for and obtained a Concealed Holder Permit, allowing me to carry a concealed firearm in all places where a concealed carry is permitted by law. If at all possible I avoid places where I am not allowed by law to carry a concealed weapon.
Because some businesses refuse to allow concealed weapons on their premises, a restriction criminals would never observe or obey anyway, those businesses put me at a disadvantage if I were to disarm in order to do business at such places. To add to the insult which implies that my armed presence is as much of a risk as an armed criminal's presence, such businesses would never consider guaranteeing my safety while in their establishment, nor would they reimburse me for any injuries caused by criminals robbing their businesses. Were I to be killed in such a circumstance they certainly wouldn't hold themselves liable for the continued support of my wife. So, I choose not to do business at such establishments for my own safety. Personally, I don't not consider my CHP to be a permit to defend a business I am patronizing against an armed robbery attempt, nor would I attack an armed or unarmed criminal simply because he is stealing merchandise or money. Businesses carry insurance to cover loss due to theft. My CHP is only to defend myself and my wife from direct physical threat.
Why should I feel unsafe? Sydney, who is said to be one class short of a law degree, at taxpayer's expense, has moved to handle his case differently from those of the other prisoners. His hearings have been postponed several times. In March of this year the "status" hearing was postponed until June 9th, and the re-sentencing hearing moved to September 10th, with the entire day being set aside for that hearing.
http://www.yorknewstimes.com/news/murderer-s-resentencing-postponed/article_8ac8cffe-d66d-11e3-9b05-001a4bcf887a.html (http://www.yorknewstimes.com/news/murderer-s-resentencing-postponed/article_8ac8cffe-d66d-11e3-9b05-001a4bcf887a.html)
However, NO printed news or Internet posting has been made of the results of either of those two hearings, IF they ever took place, or of any new hearings or court activities related to Thieszen being scheduled. Three weeks following the announced dates of the hearings and still no news. His case has dropped off the map. The Thieszen parents, those kind folks who adopted Sydney and Sasha, have sold their home and gone into hiding. They have good reason to be afraid. Sydney had stated that he was sorry that he didn't drop an electric toaster into her bath tub while she was taking a bath. Such psychotic offenders often repeat their crimes when released.
http://www.wesleylowe.com/repoff.html (http://www.wesleylowe.com/repoff.html)
Please do not disarm law abiding citizens who have complied with the abridgments of the 2nd Amendment in order to obtain a CHP so that they may defend themselves against real threats.
As a former town marshal when I was teaching at Clarks HS, I learned first hand that when seconds count police are only minutes away, even when they are sincerely trying to get to the scene of the crime ASAP. Sadly, some police take hours to respond to a 911, and some never respond to some calls. The Supreme Court of the United States has ruled in at least two separate instances that the police have no obligation to protect you from any specific lethal threat even if you have a protection order and the police know that the threat to your life is real.
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/28scotus.html?_r=0 (http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/28scotus.html?_r=0)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Warren_v._District_of_Columbia)
Dial 911 and die:
http://psacake.com/dial_911.asp (http://psacake.com/dial_911.asp)
Thanks for reading this,
Jerry L Kreps
Lincoln, NE
a.k.a GreyGeek
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GG,
That is quite the compelling story and one that I hope continues to maintain a happy ending for you and yours. With all the bellowing the anti-gun people make about not wanting to be "uncomfotable" because someone is carrying in their presence we never get to hear about situations like yours from our side of the line. Your story is truly inspirational and a great example of why we should be able to carry unfettered by laws.
Thank you for sharing and I hope they take what you have to say to heart.
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I have heard thru the grapevines that nothing will/can be done at the Market since it is conducted on/in a public access parking lot- per law.
I have not confirmed this as of yet......
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I agree that GG's story is very compelling, but I also acknowledge that very few read a long post on the internet whether or not they agree with the message
TL:dr
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I agree that GG's story is very compelling, but I also acknowledge that very few read a long post on the internet whether or not they agree with the message
TL:dr
True. They are called low information voters and full time trolls.
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I agree that GG's story is very compelling, but I also acknowledge that very few read a long post on the internet whether or not they agree with the message
TL:dr
I agree that most will not take the time to read a long post, guilty as charged sometimes, but in this case I hope the receiver, the farmers market board, do take the time to read and contemplate the message he sent.
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Reading is hard. If it can't be condensed into a meme a lot of people can't comprehend it.
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Reading is hard. If it can't be condensed into a meme a lot of people can't comprehend it.
Unfortunately, those people also vote, which is why jingle politics is so popular. Comprehension is certainly lacking. Such lack is evident when Hassebrook can claim in an ad that Pete Ricketts is a tax avoider.
http://youtu.be/AgXR8bfnMQM (http://youtu.be/AgXR8bfnMQM)
Of course he is. So was I and so are most other Americans, including Hassebrook, which makes his statement hypocritical.
Tax avoidance or dodging is a legal way of paying less taxes. If the IRS offered me an exemption I took it. So does Hassebrook, unless he is an idiot. If Hassebrook wants to write a fat check to the IRS for taxes he doesn't have to pay he has that right. But most people listening to Hassebrook's rant would assume that Ricketts is guilty of tax fraud. If that were provable Hassebrook has a civic responsibility to bring the evidence to the proper authorities. Otherwise, he is just playing the class warfare game to gain an advantage with the low information voters.
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Reading is hard. If it can't be condensed into a meme a lot of people can't comprehend it.
I actually laughed out loud.
GG email is very compelling and well-spoken. Working criminal investigation and prosecution definitely cemented my decision to carry. I hope they absorb it!
In pondering the issue, it would make more sense (and less work) for the OCFM board to simply say that they follow State and Federal laws. It's an easy out for them, no? That way they would not have to worry about extra enforcement for any bans they may pass. Then if people have an issue, they can take it up with the government...and I can get some delicious produce in peace.
I know I keep saying it, but I'm really grateful to you all for the support.
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I actually laughed out loud.
GG email is very compelling and well-spoken. Working criminal investigation and prosecution definitely cemented my decision to carry. I hope they absorb it!
In pondering the issue, it would make more sense (and less work) for the OCFM board to simply say that they follow State and Federal laws. It's an easy out for them, no? That way they would not have to worry about extra enforcement for any bans they may pass. Then if people have an issue, they can take it up with the government...and I can get some delicious produce in peace.
I know I keep saying it, but I'm really grateful to you all for the support.
in my email i sent the board, i told them to follow all state and local laws. i said it was an easy out and no one get mad because they wouldn't have to pick a side. i also alluded that anti-gun groups forcing companies to pick a side is shameful.
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in my email i sent the board, i told them to follow all state and local laws. i said it was an easy out and no one get mad because they wouldn't have to pick a side. i also alluded that anti-gun groups forcing companies to pick a side is shameful.
I hadn't thought about it that way, but really this shouldn't be about an organization making a decision about whether anyone carries in their facility, it really should be whether the laws are sufficient. If they really want to take away our guns then instead of playing games with opinion and letting the voice of a few influence the many they let the people decide and abide by that decision.
Oh, wait that was done already and they lost.
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I agree that GG's story is very compelling, but I also acknowledge that very few read a long post on the internet whether or not they agree with the message
TL:dr
True but I'm not sure that detracts from GG's excellent story because the most virulent antis are the half-educated ones who think themselves educated and superior as they lump gun owners in the lowest common denominator bucket of the most backward bucktooth bubba they can find. This is why OC in the (*gasp!*) farmers market (the secular Holy Of Holies for people who drive Toyota Yaris’s plastered with “Mean People Suck” and “Coexist” bumper stickers) has them even more dazed and confused than their usual dazed state. One of the antis on the HF Crave facebook page actually said “we’re trying to build a society here, people”; they actually think their can improve society to the point where bad people will never do bad things.
This is why intelligent and thoughtful stories like GG’s are valuable to smack them down (and they usually don’t reply). They aren't the only ones with post-graduate education or worldly experience. In fact I'll stack my visa-stamp filled passports up next to theirs any day and we'll see who has the most "cross cultural" perspective. I’ve bored a few of you and them with my tales of having lived in a West African dictatorship and why firearm ownership is a human right. I could tell them to watch Hotel Rwanda and then try to explain to me how/why lethal self-defense isn’t a human right, but the Flower Power people think that doesn’t apply to us. They think we’ve evolved beyond a society where people do such terrible things and we only need just a couple more laws to put the finishing touches on it and finally ring in the Age of Aquarius.
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True but I'm not sure that detracts from GG's excellent story because the most virulent antis are the half-educated ones who think themselves educated and superior as they lump gun owners in the lowest common denominator bucket of the most backward bucktooth bubba they can find. This is why OC in the (*gasp!*) farmers market (the secular Holy Of Holies for people who drive Toyota Yaris’s plastered with “Mean People Suck” and “Coexist” bumper stickers) has them even more dazed and confused than their usual dazed state.
Thanks feralcatkillr, now have to youtube Led Zepplin and listen to Dazed and Confused.
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This is what I sent to the OCFM people on 30 September:
Dear Sir/Madam,
First let me thank you for your time to consider my input. I appreciate the opportunity to weigh in on this subject.
Here in the Heartland of The United States of America I find some of the most hard working, down to earth people I have had the occasion to encounter. I am not a native of this state, having arrived here in 1987 from an overseas assignment. I retired from the USAF in 1992 as a Chief Master Sergeant at Offutt AFB after a career of 29 years.
I note that Article 1 of your State Constitution refers to the Right to Bear Arms and guarantees that it shall not be infringed. It does not surprise me that a state in the heart of these United States would place such an emphasis on that right. After all, when you think about it, all of our other rights, enumerated in the U.S. Constitution, are protected by the Second Amendment.
As your board deliberates a policy regarding the carry of firearms, open or concealed, in your market, I ask that you consider the U.S. and Nebraska Constitutions. Generally speaking, the people who openly carry a firearm are well versed in its use, and are of good character. The Constitutions do not levy that requirement on the people. Think about it, would a bad guy advertise that he was about to misbehave?
Thank you for your consideration
Stan Klein, Sr.
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Please see the board's statement below regarding firearms at Market.
The mission of the Old Cheney Road Farmers’ Market (OCRFM), is to “provide access to high quality, fresh food produced with integrity by local family farmers and producers, bringing value to the social, environmental, and economic fabric of our community.”
We see ourselves as an integral part of a healthy, thriving, Lincoln community. As a Board of Directors (“the Board”) we strive for excellence. We value everyone who supports the market in a thoughtful and respectful, law abiding way; to not invoke fear or any other form of disrespect for human life and dignity.
In a very short period of time, the Board has been expected to determine policy that will impact all of our customers, and we have received promises from those both for and against firearms at market that their patronage of our vendors will cease if we do not support their position. It appears we cannot avoid damage to the market regardless of our actions. However, the OCRFM does not exist to make political statements outside of the sphere of food and farming.
The Board has been advised by legal counsel that we are well within our rights to prohibit firearms at the Old Cheney Road Farmers’ Market. At this time the Board chooses to take no policy action regarding the presence of firearms within our market. We maintain that the market is a family friendly place, not a platform for political statements. We respectfully request that patrons and vendors not bring firearms to market.
This recent debate is the result of a single, holstered firearm at market carried by a long time, respectful and loyal customer. If many more firearms suddenly appear at market, the Board may interpret this as an attempt to disrespect the OCRFM and our patrons who disagree with this difficult decision. If we feel so challenged, the Board may choose to quickly and decisively prohibit firearms at the OCRFM in the future.
The OCRFM has no record of a crime ever being committed at market, and the area is generally very safe and secure. While firearms may bring comfort to those that carry them, we have heard from many patrons who are in no way comforted by the presence of a deadly weapon. We respect the 2nd Amendment rights of individuals, but we remind everyone that our goal is simply to connect local farmers with local consumers while fostering a safe, open, and welcoming space for community engagement.
OCRFM Board of Directors
October 4, 2014
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Sounds like they are trying have it both ways.
I totally support open carry though I choose not to.
For the record, I do NOT have a pair of shorts like that :laugh:(collective sigh of relief
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Sounds like they are trying have it both ways.
I totally support open carry though I choose not to.
For the record, I do NOT have a pair of shorts like that :laugh:(collective sigh of relief)
Yeah, pretty much the exact same thing Target, Chipotle, Starbucks, etc have done. They don't ban it, just "request" that people leave them at home.
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Please see the board's statement below regarding firearms at Market.
The Board has been advised by legal counsel that we are well within our rights to prohibit firearms at the Old Cheney Road Farmers’ Market. At this time the Board chooses to take no policy action regarding the presence of firearms within our market. We maintain that the market is a family friendly place, not a platform for political statements. We respectfully request that patrons and vendors not bring firearms to market.
I'm confused. The bold sentence told me that they are going to leave everything as is. So that means Miss M can carry. Right?
2nd bold says: Nope, can't carry.
So they did make a verdict by telling people they can't exercise their 2nd A. rights.
Please see the board's statement below regarding firearms at Market.
This recent debate is the result of a single, holstered firearm at market carried by a long time, respectful and loyal customer.
They like Miss M. :-)
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Note: this posting is not a tweet!
... It appears we cannot avoid damage to the market regardless of our actions. However, the OCRFM does not exist to make political statements outside of the sphere of food and farming.
Two valid assertions. However, MissMichella has been open carrying at the market in previous years and it was the Anti-2A crowd which politicized her presence and attempted to demonize her and other supporters of the 2nd Amendment. NFOA members could not, and should not, let their assertions and whines go unanswered. Those who do not contest a political statement concede to those who do.
I find it very sad, as I did in January of 2012 when I defended the Constitution on the steps of the Nebraska Capital building, that it is necessary to continue to defend that document on which our Rule Of Law in this Republic is based. There is little doubt, and history confirms, that if the 2nd Amendment is nullified then the remaining Rights will soon follow, and freedom in this country will be gone. Many say that most of the first ten Amendments are already partially or completely nullified by government actions, and that most of our freedoms are gone, and I must agree. If you haven't noticed it, it is because your ox hasn't been gored... yet. Wait until your opinion is labeled politically incorrect hate speech and you are prosecuted for a hate crime, your emails or private papers, or funds are taken without a warrant, your children cannot practice their religion in the places and the ways you did, your car is stopped without probably cause and searched without a warrant and if you do not answer personal or private questions your silence is taken as guilt and you are charged with "resisting arrest", and other rights you thought you had are no longer protected by the ninth amendment. Simply because those whom YOU elected, and who took an oath of office in which they swore to "uphold and defend the Constitution against all enemies, both foreign and DOMESTIC, and they took this OBLIGATION without mental reservations or purpose of evasion", LIED and had reservations or evasions. And why are they continually re-elected? Because they take the money earned by others, whom they demonize as "rich" or "privileged", and give it to those who did not earn it. A Quid Quo Pro for votes.
... The Board has been advised by legal counsel that we are well within our rights to prohibit firearms at the Old Cheney Road Farmers’ Market. At this time the Board chooses to take no policy action regarding the presence of firearms within our market. We maintain that the market is a family friendly place, not a platform for political statements. We respectfully request that patrons and vendors not bring firearms to market.
As a "respectful request" it has no force of law if the required and proper "No Guns" signs are not conspicuously posted at all entrances, but I suspect that many anti-2A advocates would see the request as a victory, so the board HAS made a statement with political consequences. However, as a CHP holder who NEVER carries openly I would continue to carry concealed, even at that market. What other patrons cannot see they cannot complain about.
This recent debate is the result of a single, holstered firearm at market carried by a long time, respectful and loyal customer. If many more firearms suddenly appear at market, the Board may interpret this as an attempt to disrespect the OCRFM and our patrons who disagree with this difficult decision. If we feel so challenged, the Board may choose to quickly and decisively prohibit firearms at the OCRFM in the future.
Obviously, they are asking people to not carry openly but they are not banning concealed carry, or they would have put up the necessary legal signs.
Before the Texas Clock Tower incident in 1968 people thought nothing about other folks carrying in the open because that was a generally understood unalienable right, and NOBODY had to exercise that right to make a political point. Then came the massive abridgments of that which "shall not be abridged", imposed in the following years by politicians who lied in taking their oath of office, and the massive anti-2A publicity and disinformation campaigns by the Democrats.
In the 1950's, as a 12, 13 or 14 year old boy, nobody paid any attention to me while I road my bike into the country side with my .22 rifle strapped to my back. Later, as a 15 or 16 year old, when that weapon became a sporterized M1 Garand, still nobody noticed or cared. Back then, 50 years ago, many people carried rifles in racks in the back window of their pickups, or behind the front seat, and many, many more carried handguns in their glove compartments or pockets of their clothing. Perhaps even a majority. Nobody stole the guns because guns were inexpensive and ammo was cheap. Just about every hardware or department store sold them. I don't remember as much crime back then as there is today, but back then the occasional nut caused problems, and there were armed robberies, but nobody got hysterical.
That said, consider this: armed criminals and thugs always carry concealed. When they enter an establishment with the intent of robbing it, they have the advantage. They see the person who is open carrying. The thug knows what he intends to do, but the person open carrying does not know what the thug intends to do. The thug has the element of surprise and can choose when and where to attack. His first target will be the person with the gun. If the thug has no respect for life the first shot will be to the head of the person carrying in the open, at point blank range. Or, which is unlikely, the person carrying in the open will feel something in their ribs and hear a warning, "one move and you are dead!". They won't move as the thug disarms them and then proceeds to rob the store. Now, the thug has two weapons. Or, if he was using a knife or an airgun, he now has a firearm, and the person open carrying has played into the hands of that Anti-2A people who will shout "Didn't we tell you this would happen?", etc...., besides loosing their expensive weapon.
I don't care if Farmer's Market gets robbed. I do care that someone who does not wish me well would see my gun IF I carried it in the open. I'll make my political statement at rallies, in letters to the editor, as msgs posted on the Internet. But, most importantly, I'll make my political statement at the ballot box, where it counts the most. And, if anyone is to be surprised, it will be the thug with the gun who intends to attack me. At least I'll have a fighting chance.