NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Carry Issues => Topic started by: tradhunter on October 04, 2009, 10:04:55 PM
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Recently carried into Cabelas in Kearney close to where I live, and was asked to check my gun in, or leave it at the vehicle. I asked to speak with a manager. I spoke with him regarding the "No Open Carry" policy as politely as diplomatically as I could, but naturally, he was in no position to change the policy. Ironically, I was carrying the Kimber pro carry I had purchased there, loaded with ammo I had purchased there also. I am writing an email currently to send to them regarding the policy they have. Apparently we are good enough for them to take our money for the guns and ammo, just not good enough to exercise our state constitutional right to open carry. Just thought you should have a heads up on this issue and add them to the "BLACK" list. I also sent a letter to the manager's boss who I was told had the authority to change policy. Copy of letter:
Dear Mr. Sukraw,
I am writing you today regarding a September 20th visit to your Kearney Cabelas retail store. As an avid outdoors man and firearm enthusiast, I frequently open carry where ever I go, and have never been asked to leave any establishment I have ever been in this state. That was until this visit.
I understand and respect the State's open carry rights outlined in our state's constitution, and strictly adhere to provisions outlined by our state attorney general Jon Bruning. However, on Sept. 20th, when entering the Kearney Cabelas while open carrying my Kimber pro crimson carry loaded with magtech ammo, both of which I had purchased there, I was stopped at the store by a greeter. I was asked to check my firearm in, or leave it out in my vehicle. I informed the greeter that I did not intend to remove the firearm from the holster because I was open carrying the pistol, not trading it. The greeter told me that the store had a "No Open Carry" policy. I then requested to speak with the manager on duty. The young man I spoke with was polite and receptive to my suggestions, but understandably informed me he was not in a position to change policy, only to enforce it. I asked him who I could write to or speak with regarding this issue. That sir, is how I acquired your email address.
I wanted to express my concern with your store's position on open carry, and hopefully pursued you to reconsider. Open carry is a constitutional right of every Nebraska citizen aloud to own a sidearm. It was common knowledge throughout the history of this state and country that the freedom loving, upstanding law abiding citizens wore their sidearm in plane view to let those who would threaten the life of themselves, or another helpless innocent by standard that they would have the capability to protect themselves and the innocent if threatened. Concealed carry has always been illegal because only those with sinister intentions would deem it necessary to hide the fact that they had a firearm. That reason is why one must obtain a special permit to conceal carry. Unfortunately, this sets the precedence to the public, when someone does open carry that they need to be law enforcement, or they need a special reason to. You might recall a tragic incident involving a young girl a few years back, being abducted by a man hear in Kearney, and taken to Montana to be assaulted. More than 10 by standards witnessed the man drag the girl through the parking lot, kicking and screaming, and did nothing to stop it. Not so much as a license plate number was taken, and the psychopath was able to reach Montana, and scar the girl for life. The anti-gun policy/no open carry policy did nothing to stop the Von-Maur shootings. When seconds counted in these two events, the police were only minutes away. Sometimes citizens need to act to save themselves and the lives of others. Even if you may have personal reservations on open carry, I think it sends the wrong message to the Nebraska public, the same groups of citizens that supported a young fly-tier in a garage, worthy of purchasing firearms, ammo and other shooting supplies from the company you represent, but not worthy of excersizeing their state-given constitutional right to bear those arms openly. A store policy allowing concealed carry but not open carry I believe conditions the general public to be taken back and defensive when they see someone open carrying, and conditions one to think you must obtain a special permit to open carry, or that it is illegal.
Many others share my views. I have notified the Nebraska Firearms Owners Association of this selective enforcement, and non-tolerant firearm policy, and have submitted a request to place the Kearney Cabelas Retail Store on the "Black List". Many other supporters of our rights as Nebraska citizens, along with myself, will be expressing our concerns with our dollars. I have been a loyal customer for many years and spend more money at your store on an annual basis than I care to admit, and was on my way to purchase a new eotech ar site when stopped that day. I did not return afterward, and do not intend to until said policy is ratified.
I hope to see change on the horizon for the Kearney Cabelas regarding this issue, allowing myself and others to continue our patronage. I look forward to your feedback, and hope in the near future I will be able to post the Kearney Cabelas Retail Store as an open carry supporter, encouraging everyone to show their appreciation with their business. I thank you, and everyone else who take the time to read this letter and spend on this issue. I look forward to future correspondence.
Sincerely,
Aaron from Nebraska
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"but not worthy of excersizeing their state-given constitutional right to bear those arms openly."
Ummmm...... the State did not give those rights. Art. I-1:
"All persons are by nature free and independent, and have certain inherent and inalienable rights; among these are life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness, and the right to keep and bear arms for security or defense of self, family, home, and others, and for lawful common defense, hunting, recreational use, and all other lawful purposes, and such rights shall not be denied or infringed by the state or any subdivision thereof. To secure these rights, and the protection of property, governments are instituted among people, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed.
"inherent" means we already have them. Art. I-1 only recognizes that fact.
Words mean stuff. If the State gives us a thing, they can damn sure take that thing away.
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That said, good job on taking this issue up with Cabela's.
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tradhunter
Thank you for the heads up and please update the forum when you get a reply.
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Collision of rights. We have a right to bear arms. Private property owners have a right to dictate what is and is not permissible on their property.
Cabelas allows concealed carry. I think that's an excellent compromise.
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I wonder if Cabela's requires the "only ones" to check their openly-carried duty pistols when entering the store. That might be a good question for someone to ask them.
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Don't forget Cabelas has been good to us by allowing us to set up at their open houses and giving us free meals and refreshments throughout the day. Do not stir the pot with Cabelas, please. We can ask them, but in Kearney they have some anti-gun police and city council members, along with a liberal college. The time will come, but Cabelas has been a friend to us, and I want to keep it that way.
I think a civil approach would be the best way, not a threat to blacklist them.
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Rat is right. Cabelas has been very good to use latley. Please aproach this with civility. The Cabelas events to my knowledge have produced over 600 members to the NFOA.
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I "third" the motions of lilrat and huskergun. Go concealed and "fuhget about it".
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I wonder if Cabela's requires the "only ones" to check their openly-carried duty pistols when entering the store. That might be a good question for someone to ask them.
Yes , Cabela's official policy allows only law enforcement to carry openly in their stores. CCW with a permit is fine with them, but all other firearms must be checked.
Someone else mentioned it, but I will restate that the 2nd amendment is a limit on government, not on a private business.
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I appreciate that we can carry concealed at Cabela's and I appreciate the support that they have given us.
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Cabelas has been good to us. But, I do think we can state where we will spend our dollars. The letter should have been a bit less threatening as far as the term "BlackList" goes, but I do support his effort to press Cabelas into fulling recognizing the needs of law abiding gun owners.
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Cabelas has been good to us. But, I do think we can state where we will spend our dollars. The letter should have been a bit less threatening as far as the term "BlackList" goes, but I do support his effort to press Cabelas into fulling recognizing the needs of law abiding gun owners.
Pretty much my opinion as well. I'm glad they've allowed concealed carry, but there seems to be a little room for improvement.
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Thanks for your effort and please keep us updated. Take care.
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Tradhunter, Maybe some rethinking can be struck by e-mailing again to cabelas stating the acceptance of the store's policys but still one is able to ccw in the store. as with much of the society people are begging to hear their own outcry or injustice done to them because of fear they are feeling fear of an open firearm in public and not in the field JMHO..... NOT TO SAY YOU AGREE BUT ABIDE JUST AS A respecting outdoorsman. :) :D
You can blast back at me but I am not trying to pick on you, just saying when I blow off steam and I see it differently I have a choice to correct it... or accept it makes me a better knowing I done my best to seek reconciled differences I'm just a normal guy like you.... and yes somethings make me angry but hope at my old age I've learned a few things the hardway is not always the way to go.
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Well, just an update, there has been no reply from Cabelas regarding this issue. One person writing a letter isn't going to get their attention, and I know that. The only thing that will is money, or bad press that will lead to money issues. The only way to accomplish any policy change with a company like this is to become COLLECTIVELY active, not be passive and settle for crumbs. Maybe it's just me, but if I strongly disagree with business practices a certain company exercises, I go elsewhere. Even if it means I might spend a little time finding what I want, or spending a little more supporting a business I agree with. Incremental restrictions on firearms are the number 1 threat to our firearm ownership and rights. Once those are dissolved, everything's fair game. I am fully aware of every business owners rights to restrict firearm carry, but don't you think it's extremely hippo critical of them to do what they are doing? And come on people, grow a back bone. "DON'T STIR THE POT WITH THEM!", or " "THEY GIVE US FREE FOOD". Are you kidding!?! Don't forget who needs who here! Boy, if you think putting your name on a list, calling yourself a member and wearing a funny hat full of pins is enough to secure your rights that you don't exercise, or get your hands dirty defending, you are sorely mistaken. People in a lot more powerful positions than us are working a lot harder than this against us. I find it very disheartening to hear people say they are happy with a sort of bribe for relinquishing some of their rights to a store policy. Especially a store profiting off of the very exercise being aborted. Here's an idea, GO SOMEWHERE ELSE! Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I guess I'd like to see a little spirit of the sixties, and wittiness people actively and non-violently protesting and becoming active in the community on issues important to them. Did black people "settle" for the back seat of the bus because it was an OK compromise from sleeping in the barn and being someones property? NO. All men are inherently equal, and they wanted their equality, uncompromising equality. Rights not exercised atrophy and die. For the sake of rebuttal, the right to "Open Carry" was given to us by the state, in our STATE constitution. Some states do not have open carry.
I not only am active but I also exercise my right to open carry in public because of many personal reasons, and the fact that I recognize the need to be a positive advocate to gun owners rights. I recognize that we are just as important as capitol hill lobbyists. I myself must be a polite, well informed open carrying advocate that can represent firearm owners in a positive way. That means I have to take extra precautions in how I conduct myself in public. I sometimes have to put up with funny looks, or inquiry, but I'm happy to. And for the record, I have had only positive inquiry until this day at Cabelas, and I have NEVER seen ANYONE else open carrying EVER. I would love to here excuses for that.
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Read this again, Tradhunter:
"All persons are by nature free and independent, and have certain inherent and inalienable rights; among these are life, liberty, the pursuit of happiness, and the right to keep and bear arms for security or defense of self, family, home, and others, and for lawful common defense, hunting, recreational use, and all other lawful purposes, and such rights shall not be denied or infringed by the state or any subdivision thereof. To secure these rights, and the protection of property, governments are instituted among people, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed."
Words mean something. "Inherent" means we already have those rights. The State did not give us squat. The Constitution only serves to tell the State of its limitations, not to tell We The People what we can and can't do. The laws passed and enforced by the State do that. The Constitution constrains the State in its regulation of The People.
As for :"I have NEVER seen ANYONE else open carrying EVER. I would love to here excuses for that. " ..... just because you have never seen something does not mean it does not happen. You've never seen me respond to a Fire/Rescue call- that does not mean I don't........ I know Kim, Jay and I have all OC'd in Nebraska City and Plattsmouth, for various reasons. And demanding excuses for why someone does not OC is as wrong as demanding excuses why someone CCWs......
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I see what you mean when you say the state didn't give us the right to open carry. I guess they just didn't take it away, not the same as giving it. You're definitely right there. I guess that would be like me saying churches are state funded because they are tax exempt, when in reality the state didn't give them anything, just didn't TAKE from them. By saying I have never seen anyone oc I didn't mean NO ONE does, just that it is odd not enough do that I would never see anyone, ever. When weighed out and mused over, one should be better off open carrying than cc. I don't want top get into a oc or cc debate, but if you look into long term public and political effect and endless testimonies from violent crime offenders, open carry is definitely the way to go most of the time. Thanks for your feedback.
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"but if you look into long term public and political effect and endless testimonies from violent crime offenders, open carry is definitely the way to go most of the time"
I'm curious what your source(s) is/are for such an opinion.
I know one thing you have given up the element of surprise young Skywalker.
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The People of Nebraska enshrined the right to keep and bear arms in the Constitution by petition in 1988. While the fight about just what "A well regulated militia" meant in the US Constitution was just heating up, Nebraskans set about ensuring that there wasn't any wiggle room in our State Constitution.
Carry however you wish, but by all means, Carry.
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What do we gain if we override the rights of private property owners with the right to keep and bears arms?
If I had spent a lifetime and millions of dollars building a business, I would certainly maintain that I had the right to determine what type of activity I would allow to occur on my property. Your rights end where mine begin... I will not support attempts to overthrow the rights of one group to advance those of another by anyone.
Of course we are free to choose to not do business with any company that does not support our views, but I will never agree that that company does not have the freedom to disagree.
Cabela's has been much more supportive of the RKBA than most. They purposely built their store in LaVista to bypass the restrictions that Omaha places on firearms possession. They allow for the legal carry of concealed firearms. They have the right to draw the line somewhere, and they have done so.
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I often open carry and I too have had some looks of "who the hell do you think you are?" But honestly I agree with Dan, we all have rights. And they end where the next persons begin. That is why we are a Republic.... so that no man's rights can be revoked by the "majority" or popular opinion.
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I agree 100% Dan. Smoking is legal, but I will be damned if I am going to let someone smoke in my house or pickup. Safety is also an issue. CCW holders at least have taken a class, any fool can OC if they want. If Cabelas banned CC in their business, then I might have a problem. I know a few people I would not want carrying a gun around me. There are shooting ranges that don't allow any type of carry, and no holsters. Guns must be cased and unloaded without magazines installed or loaded. This is a shooting range, not a retail store full of sheeple. However backwards that may seem to us, it is their policy, and it is their right to exercise that policy.
It is their property. If you don't agree, take your coin elsewhere. They have done more for the NFOA than any other business. We need their support.
And the food was great.
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WOW. I think you might be misunderstanding me. I don't want to over through anyone's rights as business or private property owners. I don't like "gay pride" parades, but I whole hardily support their right to so. I don't agree with Mormonism, be will defend their right to worship. This is why this issue needs brought to the forefront, and discussed:
Customer Open-Carry and Concealed-Carry of Pistols and Revolvers in Cabela?s Retail Stores
Cabela?s company policies are intended to be aligned with applicable federal, state and local laws. Accordingly, each store location has adopted policies to comply with the laws governing the state, county and city in which the store is located.
With respect to the issue of open-carry and concealed-carry of firearms by customers ? it is Cabela?s general policy to allow customers to carry a pistol or revolver within Cabela?s stores if the customer is permitted to do so in accordance with applicable law; provided such firearm remains safely holstered while the customer is on Cabela?s property, and the activities of the customer do not raise safety concerns or otherwise interfere with Cabela?s business activities.
If a customer brings a firearm on Cabela?s property for purposes of repair, appraisal, evaluation, sale or any other purpose that will require the customer or someone else to handle the firearm or remove the firearm from a holster, the firearm must be checked in with store personnel, safely unloaded and fitted with a trigger lock.
Cabela?s supports responsible gun ownership and is committed to providing a safe family shopping environment. Accordingly, Cabela?s reserves the right to implement firearm safety procedures within its stores as Cabela?s deems appropriate.
Let me know if you have any other questions.
Joe Arterburn
Corporate Communications Manager
Cabela's Inc.
One Cabela Drive
Sidney, NE 69160
joe.arterburn@cabelas.com
308-255-1204
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Looks to me like according to that letter, open carry is allowed in their stores.
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That is the way I see it too. Kearney does not have an open carry ordinance, so Trad should have been good to go.
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Open carry may be allowed in their stores...... but if a manager or employee asks you to put it up, you have to comply or leave. If they ask you to leave because you don't comply and you don't, that's trespassing..... just sayin'......
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Open carry may be allowed in their stores...... but if a manager or employee asks you to put it up, you have to comply or leave. If they ask you to leave because you don't comply and you don't, that's trespassing..... just sayin'......
Armed trespass no less, and the charge could be a serious detriment to ever carrying a firearm again
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I always get a twinge of nervousness when I go to Scheels or Cabela's while CCW (would even more so open). Afraid someone, maybe another customer will think I've shoplifted or something. Then I'd have police harassing me for an hour or more while my wife faxed up the serial number off my case...
Speaking of Scheels, anyone else hate with a passion the new bars on their "display" counters?
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I always get a twinge of nervousness when I go to Scheels or Cabela's while CCW (would even more so open). Afraid someone, maybe another customer will think I've shoplifted or something. Then I'd have police harassing me for an hour or more while my wife faxed up the serial number off my case...
Speaking of Scheels, anyone else hate with a passion the new bars on their "display" counters?
It seems just a bit overdone, doesn't it? ::)
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I sure us funny how quickly some people jumped in and said We should not interfere with the buissiness owners property rights at Cabelas. We got CC so were ok with some restrictions ??
On the front page there is a list of property owners who NFOA has identified as not supporting our rights so we should not do buissness with them ??? What about there property owners rights ??
Pro 2A or Not Pro 2a or just when it is convienient ??
Hmmm Let's think about this
I think CC is the best way to go, No sense in scaring the SHEEP if you don't have to
FLUFF
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What is funny about believing in personal property rights? The 2nd amendment has nothing to do with private property rights.
It is a limit on the power of government , not on the rights of individuals
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On one side of the fence we hammer unfrendly Business owners on our front page when they place restrictions on our CC rights.
On the other side of the fence we say it is ok for Cabelas to place restictions on our 2A rights to open carry ???
So who's rights are more important ?? Property owners or Mine
What about my rights to have the ability to protect myself ??? Are property owners going to protect me ??
Not looking to start an argument, because the question of who's rights are more important all depends on who you ask. It just appears to me like a double standard and that some people are ok accepting some restrictions on there personal rights.
My lesson in free speach came the first time I back talked to my mother and dad put a boot in my ass......
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Those bars make it near impossible to see the goods.
Was told that they are looking into a different type of bar set up.
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Okay, I'll jump in b/c I'm bored......
If a property owner doesn't want a firearm on his property, that is his/her right. You (and I) don't have to agree with them, but we must respect it (or get cited/arrested for trespassing). You and I have the same rights to decline doing business with them. No different if you choose not to shop or buy gas at a convenience store the sells porno.
Nit picking whether a business allows OC or CC is just that.....nit picking. Again, if the property owner is okay with CC and it is kosher with your philosophy support them. If you are pent up on your right to OC and they say no....excercise your right and go somewhere else. To me there is no double standard in any of this. Some here may choose to do business with those that post no CC and that is fine by me. I for one have made my choice i.e. not gonna happen.
In the illustrious words of the "Supreme Leader" in the White House, a robust dialogue is fitting in some circumstances.
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Just wanted to check in and say that I have really enjoyed reading this thread. Great discussion by all, and some great points have been made.
Yes, Kim and I OC quite a bit, so I have enjoyed everyone's thoughts here. Some of my favorite posters have chimed in with their usual wisdom which has made it even better. :)
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The reason we hammer on the unfriendly buisness is because they restrict our 2A rights completly. Cabelas at least lets us cc.
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WOW! i had no idea the kearney cabelas had that policy. i think its absurd. concealed ok, but open not ok? its not right :angry9:
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Gun shows are pretty much the same way. CCW ok, OC not. In fact some gun shows don't allow CCW. Are you all boycotting those? Probably not.
As long as Cabela's doesn't tell me I can't CCW then I could care less what their OC policy is. It's their store, they own it and they get to make the rules. Guns Unlimited has the same policy. Not sure about Scheels but I bet that OPD or LPD will be up your arse quickly if you were to try.
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Have you ever been to a gun show when someone was shot by an idiot who left a gun loaded, or loaded a gun then pulled the trigger? How about when someone loads a bullet into a firearm then leaves the table, and someone else test fires it? I have been arond all three. Too many people want to dry fire the guns to test the trigger, even on rimfires. It is a matter of safety, there are too many idiots out there to risk it. Concealed permit holders are OK with me, but the tools who don't follow the basics of firearms safety have no business carrying a loaded gun at gun shows, and unfortunatley, there isn't an idiot detector at the front gate. The promoter sets the rules, guns are brought in to be sold or traded, and too many people don't treat guns with the #1 rule, to treat every gun as if it were loaded.
Every time an accidental discharge happens, it boldens the anti's movement against gun shows. When someone is shot, it can kill the show forever. Promoters are required to carry multimillion dollar insurance policies to cover the show for such things, and if someone is shot, their premiums can and will increase substantially.
I was at the Tulsa show in 1998. A private security guard had his gun checked and banded at the door. The guard goes in, gets to the middle of the show, unbands his gun, inserts a loaded magazine, racks the slide, points it at an unsuspecting bystander's legs, and shoots the gun through his right thigh and into his left thigh, breaking his femur. I heard the shot, and an EMT across the aisle grabbed a first aid kit and ran over to help. All the rules were in place, and it still happened, because many people are idiots, and I don't want them carrying a loaded weapon anywhere near me. The guard went to Jail.
A dealer I know was set up at Hastings a few years back. He claims someone put one round of ammo from a full box into the revolver it fit while he was away from the table. He didn't realize it, and thought he would dry fire the weapon into the table. Bang! He doesn't get to set up at Hastings anymore, period. Who's fault was it? His. He pulled the trigger. What if he killed someone?
Accidents happen, stupidity is rampant, and we need to do everything we can to help prevent those kinds of accidents.
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There is now a sign in the window at the Kearney Cabelas. All firearms must be checked in with greeter. This doesn't say just "Viewable" firearms, it says ALL.
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I saw that sign in Kearney, I am not going to go 60 miles back home to get all my guns and check them in.
I'm hoping that they are meaning the guns you are bringing in for trade or warranty, I could be wrong. I will not check in a CCW gun anywhere, if that is what they are thinking, I will not shop there.
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I don't know about the Kearney store, but the Lincoln/ Omaha area Cabelas and Scheels both say that 'firearms are to be checked at door, does not apply to concealed firearms holders with issued permit"
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Ill take a pic of the sign tomorrow and post.
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It definitely says ALL.
(http://mail.cryptospace.com/cabelas.jpg)
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WOW!
Maybe a store to store thing, Personally, if LaVista was posted as such, I might think twice before shopping there. I don't purchase alot there, but I still like to browse. I wonder how the others are posted? Come to think of it, my brothers and I were there last year when in GI for HHD, and I don't recall that sign. I'm almost positive we were all 'packin'. :-\
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UPDATE
Talked to a gentleman from corporate a couple months ago( he got back to me the next day after leaving a message, while the in-store manager wouldn't return my multiple phone calls and messages for weeks). Been very busy and forgot to update everyone. He said that it is indeed the Cabelas policy that ALL Cabelas retail stores adhere to the OPEN AND CONCEAL privileges of Nebraska citizens. He said that if the state that the store is located in allows open/concealed carry they will absolutely honer it. He was an extremely professional and polite gentleman who actually answered my call while eating lunch on a business trip in Illinois and took the time to explain everything to me. He said that turnover at the retail stores is pretty high, and sometimes policies can get mottled or miss represented, and assured me the matter would be cleared up as soon as he finished his lunch. My conversation with this man reminded me why I do business there. The only guns that need to be checked are those that are going to be worked on, and if you carry you do not need to check it at the door. I have since open carried there many times with no further issues. Besides, if you carry, no matter WHAT, you NEVER unholster your weapon unless you plan to shoot it. I had some kid selling me a generator once at a local bike dealer want me to show him my gun. I though (H#!! no, u want me to get accused of aggravated assault or something!) , but I just politely declined.
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I just returned from the Cabelas store in Kearney and there are no signs; whatsoever on the front door. :)
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Is there really a need to open carry in public? Yes, we have that right just as merchants have the right to ask you not to. Show some common sense and be respectful.
Cabelas has been a great store to deal with in LaVista. I am certainly appreciative of everything that they have done in support of NFOA. In fact, I very seldom go to Bass Pro even though I have to drive all the way across Omaha to get there.
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Well said TopGlock
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Is there really a need to open carry in public? Yes, we have that right just as merchants have the right to ask you not to. Show some common sense and be respectful.
"Rights, much like muscles, wither away if not exercised regularly."
As for being "respectful", are you implying that by openly carrying a firearm, a person is being disrespectful?
Of course, we should be respectful at all times, as we are representing a polite society.
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Collision of rights. We have a right to bear arms. Private property owners have a right to dictate what is and is not permissible on their property.
Cabelas allows concealed carry. I think that's an excellent compromise.
How did our Bill of Rights get trampled on so successfully over the years? How are our rights being infringed, even if just one little step at a time? How did the language regarding being penalized by the GOVERNMENT for carrying in a biz if the biz owner puts up a sign? If you answered "compromise", you are correct sir.
Support jpfo.org, saf.org and gunowners.org as the NRA compromises.
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I do agree that there are a lot of idiots out there but insinuate that only people who hold a CCP is ok is just wrong, there are many law biding and safety minded people out there that dont have a CCP. It seems that looking through many post's in the forums that this organization is more for CCP holders rights and not for gun rights in general. I did not join this for CCP rights I joined for all gun rights but I am begining to believe that I joined the wrong orginization.
Have you ever been to a gun show when someone was shot by an idiot who left a gun loaded, or loaded a gun then pulled the trigger? How about when someone loads a bullet into a firearm then leaves the table, and someone else test fires it? I have been arond all three. Too many people want to dry fire the guns to test the trigger, even on rimfires. It is a matter of safety, there are too many idiots out there to risk it. Concealed permit holders are OK with me, but the tools who don't follow the basics of firearms safety have no business carrying a loaded gun at gun shows, and unfortunatley, there isn't an idiot detector at the front gate. The promoter sets the rules, guns are brought in to be sold or traded, and too many people don't treat guns with the #1 rule, to treat every gun as if it were loaded.
Every time an accidental discharge happens, it boldens the anti's movement against gun shows. When someone is shot, it can kill the show forever. Promoters are required to carry multimillion dollar insurance policies to cover the show for such things, and if someone is shot, their premiums can and will increase substantially.
I was at the Tulsa show in 1998. A private security guard had his gun checked and banded at the door. The guard goes in, gets to the middle of the show, unbands his gun, inserts a loaded magazine, racks the slide, points it at an unsuspecting bystander's legs, and shoots the gun through his right thigh and into his left thigh, breaking his femur. I heard the shot, and an EMT across the aisle grabbed a first aid kit and ran over to help. All the rules were in place, and it still happened, because many people are idiots, and I don't want them carrying a loaded weapon anywhere near me. The guard went to Jail.
A dealer I know was set up at Hastings a few years back. He claims someone put one round of ammo from a full box into the revolver it fit while he was away from the table. He didn't realize it, and thought he would dry fire the weapon into the table. Bang! He doesn't get to set up at Hastings anymore, period. Who's fault was it? His. He pulled the trigger. What if he killed someone?
Accidents happen, stupidity is rampant, and we need to do everything we can to help prevent those kinds of accidents.
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Dave, I don't have a CCP. My post was about accidental discharges and why promoters of gun shows don't allow loaded weapons. There is not any company who makes a handheld idiot detector, so to save their butts, they have to draw the line somewhere. Their show, their rules. I set up at a lot of shows. I unload my piece when I get inside, store the gun away, and load it when I leave. I don't want to be the idiot who has an AD. I've even had people go behind my table and grab my stowed away gun (how would you like that?) and try to buy it, that is why I unload it.
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You guys must have stirred the pot with Cabela's, I went there the other night and they have signs all over the place at the front doors saying that all guns must be checked but does not apply to concealed handguns with CHP holders. They must be having issues with people just walking back to the gun counter with weapons and not checking them.
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The LaVista store has had those signs for quite some time.
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I took my new Kahr PM40 to Cabelas to get fitted for a holster so I entered with the pistol in the box. I checked in with the guy at the front and received personal service the entire visit. He walked with me everywhere I went. It was kinda special to have that level of PERSONAL service. I saw this as a good thing in this case.
I don't think he even knew or cared that my XD40 was tucked in my waistband ;D :dink:
They do have a BIG sign before ya get to the front door that explains things.
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is this the sign you guys are talking about at LaVista's store?
(http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g50/rchaisch/0723001338-1.jpg)
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Lol, when I was there the other day they had those on the doors and some free-standing signs with the same verbage in several places around the entrance overhang. I think they are trying to make a point. :)
Ron
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I saw this same signage at the Gander Mtn store in Paducah, KY, when I was working down there this past week.
Cabela's owns Gander Mtn, don't they? ???
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Stopped in the Cabela's in Sydney NE last week on the way back from Colorado and those signs were everywhere too.