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General Categories => General Firearm Discussion => Topic started by: grumpy old man on February 25, 2015, 08:26:30 AM

Title: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: grumpy old man on February 25, 2015, 08:26:30 AM

Looking for a SHTF rifle. I am former combat tanker and I know handguns very well but rifles...well clueless is good way to put it.

Thinking of an AR .223/556 but they told me I can't hunt deer with that kind of round.  I need a rifle I can hunt deer with in case SHTF but I also need a rifle that I defend my family with too.

Too bad they don't have an AR style rifle that holds 30/30 or 306.

Any ideas would be very appreciated.   Can't spend $1500 on a rifle. $500 up to $1,000 is my budget.  Am I screwed?  :)

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: Mudinyeri on February 25, 2015, 08:52:39 AM

Plenty of options for an AR-style rifle in .308.  Do you have room in your budget for optics on top of the $500-1000? 

Personally, I've had my eye on the DPMS Compact Hunter.  MSRP is just under $1500.  They can be had for around $1200 online or on sale locally.  DPMS does offer less expensive options in .308.

Another option that might save you some money would be to build an AR-style .308.  Again, lots of options with two major "styles".  All of your components would need to be compatible with the "style" you chose.

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: shooter on February 25, 2015, 08:58:31 AM

 PTR-91, just under $1,000 mags are cheap. parts are cheap to.

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: OnTheFly on February 25, 2015, 10:49:40 AM

AR-15 in 300AAC.  Could do a short barrel and put a can on it too if you wanted.  You could have two uppers with the same lower.  One in .223/5.56 and the other in 300AAC.  Both rounds use the same magazines.

Fly

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: tstuart34 on February 25, 2015, 10:55:52 AM

223 will take a deer.... Bullet choice, Shoot placement, and range are much more critical compared to a 308 30-06. What distance are you shooting? Do you reload? If you want SHTF I would stick to something NATO 556, 308, and 762x39.

Like Fly said above you have a lot of choices for uppers. 223 and 300 BO take 556 mag and Bolt. 6.8 is great for hunting and alot of commercial ammo available just need mags and bolt. 6.5 G is the same story as the 6.8 minus the large availability of factory ammo. My choice if I had the money would be one of each maybe two of each.  ;D

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: ILoveCats on February 25, 2015, 11:25:20 AM

If "SHTF" is the mission and, say, $1000 is the budget, I always think that two rifles in two calibers is way wiser than one.  For the price of one Black Rifle I'd rather have a lever action 30-30 and a savage bolt action in .22 LR or WMR. There are also nice little bolt guns in 5.56 and 7.62 and the like. 

Understand, you might have to settle for gaudy wood rather than all that really expensive, tasteful plastic.

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: JTH on February 25, 2015, 11:28:01 AM

Quote from: brandonhein on February 25, 2015, 08:26:30 AM

Thinking of an AR .223/556 but they told me I can't hunt deer with that kind of round.  I need a rifle I can hunt deer with in case SHTF but I also need a rifle that I defend my family with too.

I'm not sure who "they" are, but you can hunt deer in Nebraska (legally) perfectly fine. 

Quote

Too bad they don't have an AR style rifle that holds 30/30 or 306.

How about .308?  300 Blackout?  7.62x39?  Got all of those...

Quote

Any ideas would be very appreciated.   Can't spend $1500 on a rifle. $500 up to $1,000 is my budget.  Am I screwed?  :)

Not at all.  I'd start with a solid 16" .223 build.  Good all-around rifle, perhaps a variable 1-4X scope.

You can later buy other uppers (that are NOT guns according to the ATF) for different purposes, including putting a 300 blackout upper on your .223 lower.

If you want, you can instead go with an AR-10 as a .308 lower/upper combo, and again, later add whatever uppers you want for different purposes. 

The AR platform is really an excellent one for an all-around rifle.  I'd really suggest the .223 lower/16" lightweight upper for a start.  After that, you can customize as you like.

(https://twg2a.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/gunsmansbarbie.jpg)

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: grumpy old man on February 25, 2015, 11:43:59 AM

Quote from: jthhapkido on February 25, 2015, 11:28:01 AM

I'm not sure who "they" are, but you can hunt deer in Nebraska (legally) perfectly fine. 

How about .308?  300 Blackout?  7.62x39?  Got all of those...


Not at all.  I'd start with a solid 16" .223 build.  Good all-around rifle, perhaps a variable 1-4X scope.

You can later buy other uppers (that are NOT guns according to the ATF) for different purposes, including putting a 300 blackout upper on your .223 lower.

If you want, you can instead go with an AR-10 as a .308 lower/upper combo, and again, later add whatever uppers you want for different purposes. 

The AR platform is really an excellent one for an all-around rifle.  I'd really suggest the .223 lower/16" lightweight upper for a start.  After that, you can customize as you like.

(https://twg2a.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/gunsmansbarbie.jpg)

I went to a gun store in Lincoln (wont say which) and was told the Nato round .223/ 556 is not a fast enough round or heavy enough round to legally shoot a deer in Nebraska.

I heard the AR10's are in the $1500 and up category. 

Thank you for your help.  I saw an AR15 .223 for mid $600 and I almost jumped on it but this gun shop told me you cant shoot a deer in Nebraska with that round. With that info I passed. 

Optics I will get later.  I would go with a good back site though one that flips up.  Magpul I think??

Any ideas on make and model?   Thank you all so much.

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: bullit on February 25, 2015, 12:09:56 PM

Quote from: brandonhein on February 25, 2015, 11:43:59 AM

I went to a gun store in Lincoln (wont say which) and was told the Nato round .223/ 556 is not a fast enough round or heavy enough round to legally shoot a deer in Nebraska.

That is why you never ask a gun store clerk about hunting rules and regs (except Cruze Lauer and Randy Moeller) or a cop about the law ......

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: Mudinyeri on February 25, 2015, 12:52:42 PM

Quote from: bullit on February 25, 2015, 12:09:56 PM

That is why you never ask a gun store clerk about hunting rules and regs (except Cruze Lauer and Randy Moeller) or a cop about the law ......

For deer and antelope, the rifle must be at least .22 caliber and deliver 900 ft lbs of energy at 100 yards (or .357 magnum rifle or .45 Colt rifle).

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: zofoman on February 25, 2015, 12:58:00 PM

When all else fails, go directly to the source for regulations:   http://www.outdoornebraska.ne.gov/hunting/Guides_Regs.asp (http://www.outdoornebraska.ne.gov/hunting/Guides_Regs.asp)
Granted this is for 2014 season.

As for modern sporting rifle options (AR15/AR10), my suggestion would be to check out Palmetto State Armory and get on their email list for daily deals/specials.  You can build what you want and save some bucks along the way.  I've used their quality products and have not had any issues.  Right now they have an AR15 clearance sale going on.    http://palmettostatearmory.com/ (http://palmettostatearmory.com/)   

Btw....AR15.com is the mecca of information site for that platform.   

There are always the YouTube videos for reviews on firearms and how-to build your own.  So much so, that it can become overwhelming if you let yourself be consumed with information overload.

IMHO, I'd suggest having a deer hunting only rifle and a shtf alternative...it's possible to do that within your budget if you take your time to shop around.   Deer rifle/scope options come available all the time and some can be had reasonably, especially now that deer season is over...tough to beat a 30-06 for all-round big game hunting...ever consider elk hunting in your future?    http://www.armslist.com/classifieds/nebraska/all/ (http://www.armslist.com/classifieds/nebraska/all/)

Good luck in your quest...would be interested in hearing what you wind up with.
 

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: Mudinyeri on February 25, 2015, 03:18:43 PM

Quote from: zofoman on February 25, 2015, 12:58:00 PM

When all else fails, go directly to the source for regulations:   http://www.outdoornebraska.ne.gov/hunting/Guides_Regs.asp (http://www.outdoornebraska.ne.gov/hunting/Guides_Regs.asp)
Granted this is for 2014 season.

Amazingly, that says exactly what I said.  (I'm a Hunter Education instructor.)

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: grumpy old man on February 25, 2015, 06:29:44 PM

Thanks everyone. I'm a Newby when it comes to this rifle stuff. Funny how I shot 6th best out of everyone in boot camp (over 100 in my company).  Elk hunting that's on my bucket list !

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: DenmanShooter on February 25, 2015, 07:41:33 PM

http://www.ruger.com/products/mini14TacticalRifle/models.html (http://www.ruger.com/products/mini14TacticalRifle/models.html)

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: Mudinyeri on February 26, 2015, 09:37:01 AM

Quote from: brandonhein on February 25, 2015, 06:29:44 PM

Thanks everyone. I'm a Newby when it comes to this rifle stuff. Funny how I shot 6th best out of everyone in boot camp (over 100 in my company).  Elk hunting that's on my bucket list !

You'll want more firepower for elk.

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: AAllen on February 26, 2015, 02:20:49 PM

Lots of good, and truthful answers here.  As you can see there is not one rifle that is a do everything, not even the mystical powers of the AR-15 can do that (but it does come close).  There are lots of details that we should be asking about what your planned use/need is.  If it is only a SHTF gun, get a good .22, even though it would not be considered ethical and under game law illegal .22 long rifle has killed lots of deer.  So in a TEOTWAWKI situation.... 

That leaves room for something else want a cheap AR that is also fun to shoot and can be used in competitions and as others have pointed out... its the erector set of the firearm world so you can upgrade parts and build it over time to do lots more.

Perhaps you want something that you can learn longer range accuracy type shooting, and doubles as an elk gun (while also being a very good deer gun) there are lots of good .308 bolt guns out there; new and used. One of these with a decent optic (not something truly long distance shooter or competition quality) could easily leave room for a nice .22 and some room to buy ammo, got to some trigger time in.

Also there are many other fine calibers in bolt guns that work very well for large game don't want to point to just one option there either, too many questions and opportunities to list them all in a forum response.

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: AAllen on February 26, 2015, 02:23:51 PM

Man I didn't even mention pump rifles, lever action rifles, semi auto rifles other that AR's... They all have their benefits and their failures.  What fits you and your needs requires more information and you trying some things out for size and experience.

Then there is also the possibility of a shotgun being the best choice for your needs and not a rifle.  From little tiny low recoil bird shot to massive slugs, ammo choices for shotguns can make them more flexible for many situations.

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: zofoman on February 26, 2015, 04:48:10 PM

I recalled reading this article earlier this year and finally re-found it.   Something to think about.

http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/gun-nuts/2014/06/best-plains-rifle-all (http://www.fieldandstream.com/blogs/gun-nuts/2014/06/best-plains-rifle-all)

My personal rifle is a nothing fancy Remington 700ADL .30-06 w/Redfield 3x9 for deer mostly but have used on antelope and elk.

Title: Re: Need help picking a rifle
Post by: mrkermit on March 22, 2015, 03:23:23 PM

I'd go for an AR in 308 but only because it's next on the list for me.