NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Carry Issues => Topic started by: sparky on May 27, 2011, 09:30:43 AM
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I just wanted to share my first "official contact" story. My car broke down the other day on Harrison street in West bound lanes by 78th Street so therefore it fell into Ralston jurisdiction. While waiting for my wife to come and get me, a Ralston officer pulled up behind me, came to my window and I explained to him my situation, he said while we're waiting can I check your license and registration so I also informed him that I was a CCW holder and was armed. He just replied "where is your weapon located" and I let him know it was in a locked gun vault under my seat and He asked to hold onto it while we wait. He was very polite about it and said "if you don't mind I'm just curious as to what you carry" and he also said brother had his permit and carried all the time.
I was wondering if anyone else has had a similar experience, overall it was fine I just hadn't actually heard of a case where the officer had secured the weapon. I know that it is definitely within their right to do that just hadn't heard of it locally and maybe it is just Ralston procedure. Not a bad experience with the exception of a broken down car but just thought I would share.
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Sounds like a positive experience. Not sure I am comfortable with the fact that he asked to your ID without probable cause i.e. traffic violation. "Fishing for the state???"
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No problems with the experience, he was very polite and sounded positive about the CCW act I was in the same boat as you though, a little weird that he wanted my license and registration for a car that was just broken down, no laws broken, no probable cause. And I understand he was well within his right to disarm me, I just hadn't actually heard of this happening to anyone else, I always hear that they let the officer know they have it and the officer's response is generally "just leave it were it is". Like I said, maybe its just Ralston procedure. Just wanted other peoples experiences.
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Somewhat surprising that the LEO wanted a secured handgun removed from a locked security case where it wasn't accessible to anyone.
Maybe the LEO was kind of a Closet Gun Nut [as contrasted to all of us Overtly Blatant Gun Nuts] who just wanted a look at your carry piece while not much else was going on.
Maybe he's a Gun Voyeur.
Lots of us are.
sfg[/b]
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Maybe, but the kicker is that it never came out of the gunvault, I just handed him the whole thing and he took it back to his patrol car (and he never had my combination) with my chp, drivers license and registration and returned them after my wife showed up and we got my car towed off the street.
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What's cool with the Forum here is that different behaviors from different LEOs regarding their handling of CHP/CCW cases get posted and read by Forum members who carry.
Takes some of the mystery out of the process and helps us deal with our own individual LEO encounters when they happen.
Geez.....the LEO never looked into the box. Definitely not a Gun Voyeur.
sfg
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Here is what I experienced and put in another thread:
I was recently in a fender bender in Omaha. A young driver rear-ended me. An OPD officer showed up to take the report and got the other driver's info first. He then walked up to me. I was standing outside the car with registration, driver's license, proof of insurance and my carry permit on top.
He said, "Hello," and I simply said, "hi, I need to let you know I have a permit to carry and I'm armed." He took all the documents and handed by my CHL without looking at it. His response was, "good for you. Thanks for letting me know."
He didn't ask what I was carrying or where, let alone ask me to surrender the gun. It was a pretty positive experience, other than the need to replace my rear bumper.
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Not meaning to go off on a tangent here, but...
Why was your gun locked in a gun vault making it inaccessible as your were driving?
Why would you not have said gun vault attached to your vehicle to help prevent it's theft?
Just trying to understand your reasoning for this.
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I was wondering if anyone else has had a similar experience
I have come in official contact with OPD twice while carrying and each time the officer seemed like they could have cared less. Although the one jokingly said as long as you leave it where it is we won’t have a problem.
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I would say your encounter was positive and most likely was the officers preference to dis- arm you. I also have to agree with FarmerRicks questions.
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I want to know why he asked for your license and registration? If you are not driving I don't think it was necessary. Of course, you have to give them what they ask for to avoid confrontations and to make sure they don't get their little power happy ego damaged.
I have been stopped twice for DOT inspections, both times I told the officer I had a permit and was armed, both times I was thanked for telling him and off he went to check my vehicle. Not once did they ask a single question about where it was or what it was. Both times I made it through with no infractions.
Kansas is a different story, spent several hours in Belleville one dark night waiting for a speeding ticket with a legal gun in the car.
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Yeah, also just wondering, if it is in the vault, why is it not secured to the seat or to the vehicle somewhere? And if it is locked up but NOT secured to the 'frame' of the vehicle, it's not really concealed, is it? Unless that cable is secured, it's really not 'legal' in some places, is that right? Of course it may depend on if you have a license and/or where you were at. Maybe it depends on the cop also? Just wondering, need to look at the rules again.
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The "why is it not secured to the vehicle, or inaccessable" issues wasn't really what I was trying to start a conversation about but since it was brought up here is how it went. At the time my car stalled out I was carrying it on my hip IWB. I turned on my emergency flashers and started walking for a gas station, got a can of cas came back and put it in the car and still would not start, called my wife and got her headed my way and while I was waiting I placed my firearm in my vault under my seat and unhooked to cable that secured it too the car so that once my wife arrived I could get down and hook the chains up, get it pulled off the street and then when I leave with her I would be able to just grab my vault and head out and go. The officer arrived several minutes after I had placed it in my vault.
That is the play by play.
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The "why is it not secured to the vehicle, or inaccessable" issues wasn't really what I was trying to start a conversation about but since it was brought up here is how it went. At the time my car stalled out I was carrying it on my hip IWB. I turned on my emergency flashers and started walking for a gas station, got a can of cas came back and put it in the car and still would not start, called my wife and got her headed my way and while I was waiting I placed my firearm in my vault under my seat and unhooked to cable that secured it too the car so that once my wife arrived I could get down and hook the chains up, get it pulled off the street and then when I leave with her I would be able to just grab my vault and head out and go. The officer arrived several minutes after I had placed it in my vault.
That is the play by play.
Got it, thanks. That all make sense to me.
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Would have been interesting if the officer had asked you to open the gun vault, as then the line gets real fuzzy and you have a decision to refuse to open or not.....in short he would need to be very assured of his "reasonable articulable suspicion" or "probable cause". Otherwise, consenting by you by opening or giving him the combo would be his only legal means of seeing what's inside.
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This is not directed at the op, but many ccw peope get a permit to simply keep a gun in the car. Its a false form of security, and it makes people feel safe who dont have the nerves to actually carry the gun. I would also guess these same people would not have the nerves to use it either to save thier own hide.
Keeping a gun in the car onlyopens it up for theft.
Get a pair, carry the gun
For the OP, maybe he just forgot to get it out if the case that day. Ive done that. UsuallyI get it out and put it on the seat, with a mindfullness to it to put my hand on it should I slam on the brakes.
Edit. Read the ops last post, understood.
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Three contacts.
First one was before CCW in NE, had gun on front seat, legally, with Omaha open carry permit on 52nd street about Saddlecreek. Long story short, in handcuffs for 25 or 30 minutes, a long-winded talking to about my not needing to have a gun and what the hell was I doing with one... He gave it back, but had me unload it and put it in my truck before being so kind as to release me. I ended up with officer M. Camp**** and his Sgt. calling me and apologizing after I lodged a formal complaint. I did enjoy letting him know the difference between the 1930's Germany and our country...
The second was by another Omaha cop, and the third a sheriffs deputy. A speeding ticket and a license plate tag expiration, respectively, both simply asked where the gun was (after divulging my CCW status) and then they each basically said "OK, thanks for telling me" and that was it.
M. Camp**** was a young cop, likely fresh from training and very, very unsure of himself in regard to the laws of the time, about 6 years ago. I'm sure that today he's a fine LEO now that he has some experience and has been better educated. Officer Camp****, "you're welcome".
*Name partially covered to help prevent moderator(s) from hyperventilating.
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I was stopped on the West Dodge Expressway by Omaha PD.
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I was a passenger when driver got pulled over. Told driver turn on the inside lights and put my hands on the dash.
Officer was doing typical 'make all of the conversation to control the conversation' -- driver finally said 'uh, my friend needs to tell ya something'. I declared the concealed carry, officer chuckled and pointed out he was wondering why I was acting a little nervous without being able to get a word in and was all kinds of happy / glad to hear I was carrying and such.
Typical short conversation followed such as what I was carrying etc. Don't believe he asked to see the permit.
This was a Bellevue PD officer.
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Second situation at declaring concealed carry was when I admitted myself to emergency room with chest pain. Was talking to the 'receptionist' and was 'oh ****, uhhhh im concealed carry and have a weapon on me' ... they were cool with it, just had to show permit and just had me deposit it in a safe behind doors. One of the receptionists also commented that she concealed carried. I then went in and got medical attention :).
This was Bellevue Medical Center near HWY 370 & 25th.
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Interesting..............
CCW in the Emergency Room is--as everbuddy knows--expressly forbidden and an instant violation of Carry Law.
So----It's really cool that the hospital ER staff was Really Cool and didn't do a Hissy Fit.
Thanks for sharing.
Good argument for going to ERs where the receptionists Pack Heat.
Maybe a sign that reads something like, "We Pack Heat, Too. CCW Welcome." would help enhance their business model.
sfg
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Interesting..............
CCW in the Emergency Room is--as everbuddy knows--expressly forbidden and an instant violation of Carry Law.
So----It's really cool that the hospital ER staff was Really Cool and didn't do a Hissy Fit.
Thanks for sharing.
According to the receptionist, the lobby area of the ER was fine for CCW, but beyond the double doors where the doctoring occurs was the big nono.
I personally wouldn't really believe this .... I'd still insist on disarming before stepping foot out of your vehicle. Maybe it's just that particular hospital's policy, I dunno. I still say disarm!
It's possible that they were okay with my carrying due to admitting myself with chest pain and other problems (ie: heart issues possible) .... and looking like doggy doodoo ... and that I was very submissive after realizing the problem / declaring it. IE: declaration/submissive and that they were more interested in getting me in to see a doc ASAP.
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UNFY:
Punctuation counts.
Here's an example:
(1) 018.01K Hospital emergency room, or trauma center;
(2) 018.01K Hospital, emergency room, or trauma center;
Number (1) is from the original Title 272, NAC, Ch. 21. In this case, only the ER and the trauma center are specified as being off bounds for CHP/CCW.
Number (2) is from the revised Title 272, NAC, Ch. 21 [10August10]. The comma after "hospital " puts the whole, entire, complete hospital complex on the CCW-forbidden list.
I've followed this particular item closely, because of frequent running in and out of a hospital on behalf of a family member. With this change, we can't just skip past the ER and TC any more while packin'. Makes the in-car handgun safe a vital accessory.
Glad that you got the Good Guys when you made your visit.
And--please stay in touch w/your cardiologist. We can't afford to lose any NFOA members.
sfg
(Quadruple By-pass Survivor; 15March2005)
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IN CASE ANYONE WONDERS HOW THAT COMMA CAME INTO BEING >:D
Senators: No concealed guns at campuses, hospitals
NANCY HICKS / Lincoln Journal Star | Posted: Wednesday, May 23, 2007 7:00 pm
Sen. Russ Karpisek says he’s a gun-loving redneck. And he gets a lot of business at his meat market from hunters.
“I’m not intending to anger the NRA,” the Wilber senator said, “but why on earth would you need a concealed weapon in a hospital?”
Is there a chance Grandma will pull her IV out and try to stab someone with it?
Might there be a doctor lurking about with a sharp scalpel?
Karpisek made his comments as senators voted to add hospitals and college campuses to the list of places at which concealed weapons are banned by law.
The law passed last year that allows Nebraskans to get permits to carry concealed weapons contains a long list of places in which guns are automatically banned, from political fundraisers to churches and banks.
It includes emergency rooms, but not hospitals. It covers elementary and high schools, but it doesn’t specifically mention colleges.
Since they were not on the list, hospitals and private and public colleges had to put their own bans on concealed weapons and post signs at every entrance when the law took effect in January.
Most colleges in the state already banned students from having firearms. And University of Nebraska students with hunting rifles store them with campus police, said Richard Wood, general counsel for NU.
NU Regents in January outlawed concealed weapons and campuses posted signs.
At the University of Nebraska-Lincoln, that meant more than $700 for “no gun” decals placed on parking lot signs, according to UNL spokeswoman Kelly Bartling. UNL considers parking lots to be the entry to the campus.
“This will make it easier and more uniform for us,” Nebraska State College System Chancellor Stan Carpenter said about including colleges in the laundry list of places where concealed weapons are automatically banned.
Senators set out to correct the college oversight in an unexpected amendment first broached late Wednesday night then carried over to Thursday morning.
Some said they had worked out an agreement with the National Rifle Association: colleges yes, hospitals no. The NRA wouldn’t oppose putting colleges on the list, and senators wouldn’t try to make any more changes to the bill, several senators explained.
But Omaha Sen. Ernie Chambers wasn’t a party to that agreement. In fact, he called it “falling into the abyss of sheer stupidity,” “preposterous” and “dealing with the devil.” He decided to try adding hospitals to the list of places automatically free from concealed weapons.
Sen. Brad Ashford of Omaha, who brought the college amendment to senators, conceded there was little difference between colleges and hospitals, but he had agreed to the deal.
“Although there is no logic, I made that commitment,” he said.
But many other senators who weren’t party to the agreement said guns at hospitals made no sense.
“I have shot a lot of guns,” said Sen. Norm Wallman of Cortland. “I have never shot my friends. I have never shot myself. But why should we have guns in hospitals? This is an excellent amendment.”
Senators added hospitals and colleges to the list and gave the bill second-round approval after almost an hour of debate.
Posted in Govt-and-politics (http://journalstar.com/news/local/govt-and-politics) on Wednesday, May 23, 2007 7:00 pm Updated: 2:28 pm.
Read more: http://journalstar.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/article_efd508a9-0668-55c8-b1b9-6089d9fd96b7.html#ixzz1WM8SCIEr (http://journalstar.com/news/local/govt-and-politics/article_efd508a9-0668-55c8-b1b9-6089d9fd96b7.html#ixzz1WM8SCIEr)
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The insane running the asylum......
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I can think of a good reason why i shouldn't be barred from bringing my handgun with me into the hospital: So i don't have to fear that my gun gets stolen from the car if some thug decides to smash out the window and steal the cd player. Then I am minus my gun and a criminal (felon) has gotten a hold of a gun. I thought the legislature is trying to keep guns out of the wrong hands?
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Turns Out..............
We Really Don't Have Concealed Carry in Nebraska.
We have Concealed Carry, Ltd. >>>>>> Concealed Carry, Limited.
Very Limited. Quite Light.
sfg
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I can think of a good reason why i shouldn't be barred from bringing my handgun with me into the hospital: So i don't have to fear that my gun gets stolen from the car if some thug decides to smash out the window and steal the cd player. Then I am minus my gun and a criminal (felon) has gotten a hold of a gun. I thought the legislature is trying to keep guns out of the wrong hands?
Not to mention it necessitates more gun handling and doesn't that increase the odds of blasting something unintentionally?
It's not about safety or concerns for "public welfare." It's simply there to pacify the "we don't like guns anywhere crowd."
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While this is not something I would fight tooth and nail to change, I find it odd that someone would question why anyone would need a gun in a hospital. Is a hospital any different from a college or high school campus, or a bank? Don't we have dozens, or hundreds of examples of people taking guns illegally into these places, even though it was already against the law? So, we shouldn't be allowed to defend ourselves if we're in one of the supposedly gun-free zones? People need to realize that it's not the CHP holder who is going to rob the bank or shoot high school or college students. It is just as unlikely that a CHP holder is going into a hospital to shoot someone. As far as I'm concerned, there is no place a CHP holder should not be allowed to go as long as there is any chance that someone else might disobey the law and go in with a firearm. Places that have metal detectors and/or other procedures for making sure no one gets in with a gun "might" be a different story. Even then, we apparently can't keep weapons out no matter what we do, as there have been courtroom shootings and bombs on airplanes.