NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Firearms Training and Education => Topic started by: HuskerXDM on April 04, 2013, 09:32:13 PM
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Just got this from Sgt. loveless. Pass it along to anyone who hasn't applied for the CHP yet and will be doing so in Lincoln
Effective Monday, April 8, 2013, all fingerprinting services at our CID Lincoln office will be by appointment only. Appointments will be taken by phone only starting on Thursday, April 4, 2013. Applicants can call our main number of 402-479-4971.
Due to the volume of permit applications and the extensive wait times for those applicants, we have determined that this will be the fairest method to provide our services. The applicant is responsible for scheduling their appointment, but we are asking that you advise the applicants that they must call for an appointment. If an applicant comes to our office without an appointment, we will schedule a future time with them at that point. Applicants should call our main number 402-479-4971 to schedule their time. We are hoping to add this to our website to allow for applicants to request a time online in the future. We will advise you when this is available.
Please download the latest version of the CHP Application on the NSP Website. It has the latest contact information and hours of operation for each NSP fingerprinting location.
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Enough people complained about the 45 days, that now, they are limiting the amount of people in the process at any given time.
Squeaky wheel did not get the grease, it got the brakes applied. Other offices that do appointments, may have a weight of a month or more to get the ball rolling. That changes 45 days, to an effective 75 days (or more) if my math is any good.
As their lobby is the size of a bathroom in an efficiency apartment, I think switching the process to appointment only, is not a bad idea. There were a dozen people in the lobby the day we applied, and it is not healthy to cram that many people in a small space for several hours.
My 45 days is today. Have not checked the mail in a few days. I am in no hurry.
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I disagree. They can only process X number of fingerprints a day. That doesn't change, they are just (hopefully) organizing it so now you don't go in wondering if the wait for printing will be 10 minutes or an hour. The law still says 45 days and they must issue permits at that point.
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I disagree. They can only process X number of fingerprints a day. That doesn't change, they are just (hopefully) organizing it so now you don't go in wondering if the wait for printing will be 10 minutes or an hour. The law still says 45 days and they must issue permits at that point.
45 days form when you apply. So if it takes 30 days to get a printing appointment that turns into 75 days to get the permit, is what I think he was getting at.
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45 days form when you apply. So if it takes 30 days to get a printing appointment that turns into 75 days to get the permit, is what I think he was getting at.
Correct sir, thank you for helping clarify my point. What was 45 days from first contact with the State Patrol, is now going to possibly double, if your appointment is set out 45 days.
Will be interesting to see how many people crowd into their office tomorrow
after reading this thread! :o :o :o :o :o :o
I think, what it will do, it will become a wait to get the appointment, then the permits will come along in about 30 days. An office, given a task, can only do so much. You cannot force a fire hose amount of water through a kitchen faucet.
I think this is a good solution to a problem. Good idea that should have been implemented earlier. I know I wish I had not waited in that sweat box lobby of theirs 4 hours.
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I see your point. It will be interesting to hear what applicants have to say about this. Hopefully someone will talk us through their process timeline starting next week.
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Thinking all the time (on good days) it seems to me, the day you schedule your class, you could also schedule youe Highway Patroll date for the next day, or soon as possible after. As most schools are a month or two backloged, that would be about right.
Everyone that thinks this is a good idea, please send me a box of ammo. Lol
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I think this is a good solution to a problem.
Another "good solution" is to move additional employees to that area, or hire them, to stay within the legal requirement of giving the CHP applicant their permit within the prescribed 45 days.
Obama is a better salesman than anyone ever guessed. I saw a statistic that stated there are now 88.7 guns for every 100 citizens in this country. That puts the number of firearms in this county at 272 million, and I'd wager that less than 1/4th of them are "registered".
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more desks, chairs, photocopiers, larger offices, additional buildings, larger budgets, more taxes yadda yadda yadda.
do we want a larger investigative branch of the state patrol?
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do we want a larger investigative branch of the state patrol?
No, but more effective use of the employees available is always an option. I worked in state government for more than a decade and I know from personal observation that perhaps 5 to 10% of the 350 employees in the division I worked in were working slow (loafing), hiding out in meaningless paper shuffling jobs, etc. When the crunch caused by 9/11 came the dept head had everyone, regardless of age, rank or YOS, working on the mail line, and that included the tax commissioner herself, because she couldn't find enough money in the budget to hire the traditional 70 temporary employees that were usually hired around tax time each year.
They KNOW there is a crunch going on right now. They can temporarily reassign a few employees to help with the crunch, assuming that the crunch isn't taking place at the Federal level with the background checks.
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Enough people complained about the 45 days, that now, they are limiting the amount of people in the process at any given time.
Squeaky wheel did not get the grease, it got the brakes applied. Other offices that do appointments, may have a weight of a month or more to get the ball rolling. That changes 45 days, to an effective 75 days (or more) if my math is any good.
What offices are currently making people wait an entire month before they can get an appointment? Even better, are doing it consistently?
And weren't people currently complaining about the 4-hour waits and such in Lincoln? Won't this fix that? Or are people going to complain no matter what?
I'm thinking that the complaints about the 45 days weren't even remotely the issue behind this change, particularly because this won't actually change their volume of permit applications. Unless, of course, you are saying they will make people wait a month for an appointment even if there are no other appointments?
As their lobby is the size of a bathroom in an efficiency apartment, I think switching the process to appointment only, is not a bad idea. There were a dozen people in the lobby the day we applied, and it is not healthy to cram that many people in a small space for several hours.
So, you think this is actually a good idea---but you are arguing against it saying that it is a reaction to complaints about permit times, even though it won't actually change the volume of permit applications unless the state patrol lies to applicants?
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Folks.........
We have a preview here of what will become of our medical treatments and services under ObamaCare. [Woops.....under the Affordable Care Act.]
Won't be Affordable and Won't be Care.
sfg
[/size]
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What offices are currently making people wait an entire month before they can get an appointment? Even better, are doing it consistently?
And weren't people currently complaining about the 4-hour waits and such in Lincoln? Won't this fix that? Or are people going to complain no matter what?
I'm thinking that the complaints about the 45 days weren't even remotely the issue behind this change, particularly because this won't actually change their volume of permit applications. Unless, of course, you are saying they will make people wait a month for an appointment even if there are no other appointments?
So, you think this is actually a good idea---but you are arguing against it saying that it is a reaction to complaints about permit times, even though it won't actually change the volume of permit applications unless the state patrol lies to applicants?
What offices are currently making people wait an entire month before they can get an appointment? Even better, are doing it consistently?
And weren't people currently complaining about the 4-hour waits and such in Lincoln? Won't this fix that? Or are people going to complain no matter what?
I'm thinking that the complaints about the 45 days weren't even remotely the issue behind this change, particularly because this won't actually change their volume of permit applications. Unless, of course, you are saying they will make people wait a month for an appointment even if there are no other appointments?
So, you think this is actually a good idea---but you are arguing against it saying that it is a reaction to complaints about permit times, even though it won't actually change the volume of permit applications unless the state patrol lies to applicants?
I am saying, looking back over the past several months, the most objectionable day I spent was that 4 hours in the lobby waiting to be fingerprinted. I am an amputee with my good leg, not being that great, and I stood the majority of that time.
People often times confuse activity with accomplishment. A better accomplishment of my time and energies would have been getting an appointment at an office doing appointments, and going in and taking care of business in an environment suited to the task.
Once the Lincoln office gets set up doing business by appointment, I am sure everyone involved will be much happier by the whole process.
Having experienced the walk in and stand around 4 hour method, I think the appointment method is going to be far superior.
Would be interested in hearing from folks that have used other state patrol offices that already do the procedure by appointment to get their perspective.
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What is Wisconsin doing differently from Nebraska as far as issuing permits?
http://walworthcountytoday.com/news/2012/dec/09/concealed-carry-one-year-report-card/ (http://walworthcountytoday.com/news/2012/dec/09/concealed-carry-one-year-report-card/)
It’s been a little more than a year since Wisconsin adopted the concealed carry law, and despite high profile tragedies in Milwaukee, law enforcement officials in Walworth County report that the Wild West has not returned like detractors claimed it would.
The Wisconsin Department of Justice has approved more than 138,500 concealed carry permits since Act 35 went into effect Nov. 1, 2011, and DOJ statistics show that handgun sales are up 90 percent since 2010.
Nebraska is no where near that number of permits total since our law was passed over 5 years ago.
What is Nebraska doing differently that makes it necessary for them to take over twice as long(Wisc. is 21 days, afaik), and charge twice as much?
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The Omaha Office wasn't much bigger
It's 2 rooms both about 9 foot X 9 foot.
the Lobby area has only 2 chairs and the fingerprint office area is full of equipment.
There were only 2 Lady's working in that office the day i went in for my CCW.
but it still took 20 Min's to do all the Prints (Electronic Digital) and then the Digital Photos for my CCW.
So if they are doing this for the CCW prints too then I'd tell anyone even after gettin an appointment to expect at least 30 Min's processing time once they get to the office thats If they have everything (paperwork, Id's and money) in order and all ready to go.
Also Remember for the CCW application form you have to fill out.... It needs to be notarize and they "DO NOT OFFER" or have notary services at the State patrol offices.
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What is Nebraska doing differently that makes it necessary for them to take over twice as long(Wisc. is 21 days, afaik), and charge twice as much?
Wisconsin is not using a fingerprint-based check with the FBI like Nebraska State Patrol is required by law to use. Instead, Wisconsin bureaucrats search their own state law enforcement database and run a NICS check. That is a major difference that substantially reduces the amount of time and expense necessary to complete the process as compared to how the law dictates that NSP do it here in Nebraska.
(9g)?Background checks.
(a) The department shall conduct a background check regarding an applicant for a license using the following procedure:
1. The department shall create a confirmation number associated with the applicant.
2. The department shall conduct a criminal history record search and shall search its records and conduct a search in the national instant criminal background check system to determine whether the applicant is prohibited from possessing a firearm under federal law; whether the applicant is prohibited from possessing a firearm under s. 941.29; whether the applicant is prohibited from possessing a firearm under s. 51.20 (13) (cv) 1., 2007 stats.; whether the applicant has been ordered not to possess a firearm under s. 51.20 (13) (cv) 1., 51.45 (13) (i) 1., 54.10 (3) (f) 1., or 55.12 (10) (a); whether the applicant is subject to an injunction under s. 813.12 or 813.122, or a tribal injunction, as defined in s. 813.12 (1) (e), issued by a court established by any federally recognized Wisconsin Indian tribe or band, except the Menominee Indian tribe of Wisconsin, that includes notice to the respondent that he or she is subject to the requirements and penalties under s. 941.29 and that has been filed with the circuit court under s. 806.247 (3); and whether the applicant is prohibited from possessing a firearm under s. 813.125 (4m); and to determine if the court has prohibited the applicant from possessing a dangerous weapon under s. 969.02 (3) (c) or 969.03 (1) (c) and if the applicant is prohibited from possessing a dangerous weapon as a condition of release under s. 969.01.
3. As soon as practicable, the department shall do the following:
a. If the background check indicates sub. (3) (b), (c), (d), or (e) applies to the applicant, create a unique nonapproval number for the applicant.
b. If the completed background check does not indicate that sub. (3) (b), (c), (d), or (e) applies to the applicant, create a unique approval number for the applicant.
(b) The department shall maintain a record of all completed application forms and a record of all approval or nonapproval numbers regarding background checks under this subsection.
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Wisconsin is not using a fingerprint-based check like Nebraska State Patrol is required by law to use. Instead, Wisconsin bureaucrats search their own state law enforcement database and run a NICS check. That is a major difference that substantially reduces the amount of time necessary to complete the process as compared to how the law dictates that NSP do it here in Nebraska.
So, it takes 24 days to run fingerprints? Seems a bit fishy to me.
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So, it takes 24 days to run fingerprints? Seems a bit fishy to me.
Ask the CJIS people at the FBI.
Criminal history record check requests for employment, licensing, or other non-criminal justice purposes are treated differently by CJIS than those that are run for criminal justice purposes.
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I understand the ID card that Nebraska issues is farmed out to another state, and that also adds to the time involved.
Maybe if you have a stalker, or some other extenuating circumstances, the 45 days would seem like a long time, but I am just now at my 45 day mark, and it does not seem like a big deal at all. The fees likewise, seem acceptable to me, though I think I like the Vermont deal better, where when you are born, you have a CWP already, called The Second Amendment.
I have little doubt if we did not have Chambers, we might be a sister state to Vermont. As it is, I am OK with what we have, as long as no more rights are thrown under the bus.
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The NSP office in Scottsbluff has been using the appointment system for several months now. Like others their waiting area is small. The person doing the fingerprinting has other duties as well yet is working 8-12 people thru a day at least 3 days a week. They have also been behind since the first of the year
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Nebraska is no where near that number of permits total since our law was passed over 5 years ago.
That article was written on Dec 9, 2012. Between Nov 1, 2010 and then would be about 2,060 working days. With about 8 hours be working day that works out to be 67 per day or 8.4 per hour. When I applied for my license the guy taking my finger prints took about 20 minutes to do it. That works out to about 3 people per hour. If Nebraska wants to improve on that choke point they could assign/hire two extra people to help out there. That would raise Nebraska's processing rate to 9 per hour, about the same as Wisconsin's.
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That article was written on Dec 9, 2012. Between Nov 1, 2010 and then would be about 2,060 working days. With about 8 hours be working day that works out to be 67 per day or 8.4 per hour. When I applied for my license the guy taking my finger prints took about 20 minutes to do it. That works out to about 3 people per hour. If Nebraska wants to improve on that choke point they could assign/hire two extra people to help out there. That would raise Nebraska's processing rate to 9 per hour, about the same as Wisconsin's.
That would only work if they also invested in more digital finger printing equipment and camera/printer.
Possibly more office space for that equipment too.
When I had my prints taken, about 3 weeks ago, I was told when I walked in that it would be about an hour wait. So I went down the street and got a sandwich. Came back and spent all of about 5 minuets waiting in the little waiting area. NO WAY I would stand & sit in that room for more than an hour.
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That would only work if they also invested in more digital finger printing equipment and camera/printer.
Possibly more office space for that equipment too.
True. In our era of tight budgets that would be a deal breaker.
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That article was written on Dec 9, 2012. Between Nov 1, 2010 and then would be about 2,060 working days. With about 8 hours be working day that works out to be 67 per day or 8.4 per hour. When I applied for my license the guy taking my finger prints took about 20 minutes to do it. That works out to about 3 people per hour. If Nebraska wants to improve on that choke point they could assign/hire two extra people to help out there. That would raise Nebraska's processing rate to 9 per hour, about the same as Wisconsin's.
Wisconsin's CCW law went into effect in 2011, not 2010. Need to re-do some math.... ;)
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Wisconsin's CCW law went into effect in 2011, not 2010. Need to re-do some math....
Yup. That's a typo on my part, but the math is good because a year still holds 365
days, or 2040 working hours, assuming a one week vacation, and the gap was about 20 working hours longer than a year.
The article sited was a "one year report card" on CCW, published on Dec 9, 2012. It states:
It’s been a little more than a year since Wisconsin adopted the concealed carry law, and despite high profile tragedies in Milwaukee, law enforcement officials in Walworth County report that the Wild West has not returned like detractors claimed it would.
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The Wisconsin Department of Justice has approved more than 138,500 concealed carry permits since Act 35 went into effect Nov. 1, 2011, and DOJ statistics show that handgun sales are up 90 percent since 2010.
An interesting side note is that even though the handgun sales nearly doubled the "wild west" never appeared. This becomes a data point to refute the gun grabbers who claim we'll be returning to the days of the gunfights on streets of Dodge City.
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Called into Grand Island and the fingerprint waiting list had me out to may 7. Called Lincoln and they can get me in tomorrow. Not sure, but it seemed like it being a renewal makes a difference. She acted like there are two seperate lines. Maybe not.
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Went to Omaha NSP today, got in & out in about 10 minutes for my printing & renewal. ;) The lady doing the prints was also very nice and fun to chat with.
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Yup. That's a typo on my part, but the math is good because a year still holds 365
days, or 2040 working hours, assuming a one week vacation, and the gap was about 20 working hours longer than a year.
The article sited was a "one year report card" on CCW, published on Dec 9, 2012. It states:
An interesting side note is that even though the handgun sales nearly doubled the "wild west" never appeared. This becomes a data point to refute the gun grabbers who claim we'll be returning to the days of the gunfights on streets of Dodge City.
Not that those days ever really existed, of course. See this review by my friend Ed Stringham of a book that dispels the myth of the violent, lawless Wild West: http://www.gordon.edu/ace/pdf/F06F&E4748BR8Stringham.pdf (http://www.gordon.edu/ace/pdf/F06F&E4748BR8Stringham.pdf)
Here's the book itself: http://amzn.com/0804748543 (http://amzn.com/0804748543)
Stanford took down a page with excerpts from some other sources that address this issue, but thankfully we have archive.org: http://web.archive.org/web/20070314143516/http://west.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/pager.php?id=18 (http://web.archive.org/web/20070314143516/http://west.stanford.edu/cgi-bin/pager.php?id=18)
There were never more than five murders in any given cattle town during a single year despite the presence, on both sides of the law, of gunfighters. . . . During the peak years of cattle towns, the average number of homicides was only 1.5 a year for each town.
This restricted (at least when compared to myth) number of murders did not result from the potential murderer’s fear of quick and violent retaliation. When murders did occur, cattle-town residents did not demand excessive punishment. Cattle-town merchants feared that executing a cowboy just because he had killed another cowboy might discourage Texans from returning and spending their money.
Source: White, Richard. "It’s Your Misfortune and None of My Own ." University of Oklahoma Press, 1991. 330.