< Back to the Main Site

Author Topic: In competition, check your previous decisions...  (Read 2048 times)

Offline JTH

  • NFOA Full Member
  • **
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 2300
  • Shooter
    • Precision Response Training
In competition, check your previous decisions...
« on: October 18, 2016, 11:18:17 AM »
I was out at the range the other day, shooting the Accelerator stage from Steel Challenge...


If you number the plates from right to left, 1-5, I would normally draw to #5, then shoot 4, 1, 2, and then the stop plate (#3).

My reasoning:  I want to draw to a fairly easy target (and that big rectangle, even at 20 yards, isn't that difficult), I want to shoot at the hardest target early in the stage (and I'm shooting it second), and I want to minimize my transitions as much as possible (hence 5, 4, 1, 2, 3).

I always did decently, but not great.  That #4 is harder than it looks, and a screwup there tends to add a lot of time.  Overall, my Accelerator times were okay for my level, but never really spectacular, and even my best stage time wasn't good compared to the expected peak time.  (I have a 13.25, with the peak time being 11.50.  My more NORMAL stage times for that are upper 14s.)

While talking with another shooter about stage plans and such, I decided to draw to the hardest target on the stage (#4) and run a plan of 4, 5, 1, 2, 3.  This pretty much goes against EVERYTHING I've ever done on an SC stage---my first shot tends to be one of my least accurate, so I try to always draw to something simpler.

My first run with the new stage plan was 0.3 seconds faster than my previous BEST run the old way.  Every time I did it afterwards was at least 0.2 seconds faster---my WORST run the new way was still 0.2 seconds faster than my best run the old way.

That's ridiculous.

I realize that 0.2 doesn't seem like much, but that's a total of 0.8 seconds for a stage---and Steel Challenge stages are sometimes won by a few hundredths of a second.  If I can save a full second (which is more likely), that's huge.

YUUUGE.

(For example, I easily ran a 3.00 Accelerator using the new plan.  My previous BEST EVER single run was a 2.97.)

Now, this new plan did NOT work with .22 Rimfire or PCC for me.  (I checked.)  But for Production, the difference was significant.  I could go into the reasoning, but that reasoning makes sense only in terms of my specific skills---more importantly, the different relative level of different skills I have. 

My skills, relative to each other, have changed since I first started shooting matches.  But I haven't re-thought (and more importantly, checked out on a timer) my plans in terms of those new skill levels.  In some cases, a different plan might not make a difference.

But then again, it might.  (As in this case.)

What skills of yours have changed?  Will it make a difference to how you shoot stages?  (I know it affects how I make my stage plans for USPSA matches---I just hadn't applied that sort of thinking to SC stages.)

Precision Response Training
http://precisionresponsetraining.com

Offline JTH

  • NFOA Full Member
  • **
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 2300
  • Shooter
    • Precision Response Training
Re: In competition, check your previous decisions...
« Reply #1 on: October 19, 2016, 10:58:23 AM »
Apparently I'm too boring to read.  :)

Thought I'd come back and also add a link to the discussion of "how to shoot this stage" that occurred on the BrianEnos forum, because that might give folks a different perspective on other people's opinions on how this should be handled---often based on THEIR particular skillsets.

http://forums.brianenos.com/index.php?/topic/33220-accelerator/

I note that the current world record on Accelerator is 8.94 seconds, meaning an average of 2.23 per run.  That's Max with an Open gun.  Given that, if I can get to the point where I consistently break 12 seconds for the stage (average of 3.00 seconds per run, which I can't do yet---matter of fact, my best time ever is 13.25, which is pretty far off, and my average is considerably worse) I'll be very happy.
« Last Edit: October 19, 2016, 11:10:00 AM by jthhapkido »
Precision Response Training
http://precisionresponsetraining.com

Offline Mali

  • NFOA Full Member
  • **
  • Join Date: Jan 2013
  • Posts: 1718
  • My life, my rights.
Re: In competition, check your previous decisions...
« Reply #2 on: October 19, 2016, 11:32:36 AM »
Actually, I read this and thought you had a valid point, but didn't make it a point to reply. I apologize for that.

Although it is not competition shooting, I do compete in computer game tournaments and have done so for over 20 years. Sometimes I will be reviewing a video of another competitor's match and how their team won a match. In the process I realize that they are doing something on the map that I don't do the same way and the results were much better for them then I am experiencing even though I have been playing the game for so much longer. Changing to that strategy improves the results for my team and we win more often.

We are all never too experienced to review others actions and update our processes, whether it be in shooting, games, or even work.

If we fail to grow then we wither and fail.
Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same. - Ronald Reagan

Offline abbafandr

  • Powder Benefactor
  • *
  • Join Date: Nov 2012
  • Location: Omaha
  • Posts: 891
Re: In competition, check your previous decisions...
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2016, 01:34:21 PM »
I can tell you from experience, that going 1,2,3 4,5, doesn't work well >:D

Offline JTH

  • NFOA Full Member
  • **
  • Join Date: Jan 2009
  • Posts: 2300
  • Shooter
    • Precision Response Training
Re: In competition, check your previous decisions...
« Reply #4 on: October 19, 2016, 04:03:27 PM »
Actually, I read this and thought you had a valid point, but didn't make it a point to reply. I apologize for that.

No need to apologize.  No one ever ""must" respond to anything---I was just joking.  :)
Precision Response Training
http://precisionresponsetraining.com

Offline Greybeard

  • Bronze Benefactor
  • ***
  • Join Date: Mar 2010
  • Location: Papillion, NE
  • Posts: 406
  • Live Free or Die!!
Re: In competition, check your previous decisions...
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2016, 08:47:38 PM »
FWIW Thomas, I read a lot of stuff on the forums that I don't respond to, mostly because I am not smart enough on the subject to make a pertinent comment. I do enjoy your stuff, your writing style and the spirited debates between you and other members on the forum. Carry on, Sir!!
 
WØCHF

Offline kozball

  • Steel Benefactor
  • *
  • Join Date: Jan 2011
  • Location: Papillion
  • Posts: 524
Re: In competition, check your previous decisions...
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2016, 10:30:45 PM »
I have found myself changing my decision from 1 string to the next. For me, sometimes it just doesn't feel right, and I try something else. If I would practice at all, I might have a better feel.

I shoot 22 pistol, which allows the shooter to start from a low-ready position. All centerfire starts from a holster. Normally, I will engage plate 2 on my rise to engage plate 1, then 5, 4, 3. Then I will change to 1,2 5, 4, 3. For me, I don't think it matters much. I seem to run about 5 second strings no matter.

Now, I know how blazing fast you are, and I respect your post about thought process. I would guess that most people don't give it any thought. Look at the stage, form a plan and shoot it. Never a second thought about doing it differently. I do think that practice is the key, as it would allow you to try different things, if you choose.

This is what always gets me. Like I said, I know how fast you are, and I know you are always trying to get better. Your 13.25 seconds for 20 hits per stage is about 2/3 of a second per hit. 2/3 of a second! I can't hardly comprehend 2/3 of a second from last hit to next target acquisition and fire then on to the next.

Then, I checked my best stage score and it was 19.64, which is way worse than your 13.25, but probably about mid pack with the part timer like me. HUGE difference between the 2 times. Then I start to think  ::) and I figure that we are only 1/3 of a second per hit different. That is like a heartbeat.

So for you to change your decision on engagement is a huge deal.
0.2 seconds at your level is almost 10% overall. Pretty good decision as I see it, and it emphasizes the question if anyone considers their engagement decision.
\"Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn\'t pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same.\"

Ronald Reagan