Author Topic: Omaha city parks ban? (Read 6226 times)

omaharj · « **on:** February 27, 2012, 01:21:10 PM »

Democracy Park,at 88th and Templeman St. has a sign in the parking lot that says concealed carry is banned in the park. When did these go up? They don't match the state guidelines, but I suspect whoever had them put up doesn't care. Was there ever any discussion? I only noticed the sign because I parked right in front of it. Simple black and white sign, about 18 X 24 inches. RJ

Mudinyeri · « **Reply #1 on:** February 27, 2012, 01:26:48 PM »

I frequently run in Tranquility Park and I've noticed they have a no weapons sign as well.

bullit · « **Reply #2 on:** February 27, 2012, 01:56:44 PM »

The only state "guideline" is that it must be "conspicuous".

OnTheFly · « **Reply #3 on:** February 27, 2012, 02:30:28 PM »

How can the possibly post an entire park and consider it legal when their are infinite routes to enter the park?!

Quote from: CC'er to Officer during 'Official Contact'

No officer I did not park in front of the sign or enter on the path. I came in on the grass and there was no sign posted.

I was worried that Lincoln would go to the expense of attempting this. Thank goodness they have not.

Fly

omaharj · « **Reply #4 on:** February 27, 2012, 02:40:59 PM »

Bullit- You are correct,I was not

There is a "strongly suggested" reference to the red circle with a line in it.
Anybody able to find where there was an official statement about this? I wouldn't be surprised if someone made an executive decision

Mudinyeri · « **Reply #5 on:** February 27, 2012, 02:45:54 PM »

Found this from back in 2006: http://www.ketv.com/news/9551103/detail.html

Quote

Fahey has decided that places such as city golf courses, parks, ice skating rinks and other properties will be concealed-weapon-free areas, even after the new law is implemented.

Not sure how Fahey could have made that decision unilaterally.

NE Bull · « **Reply #6 on:** February 27, 2012, 03:17:53 PM »

Lincoln parks, (last I knew) are also Free Crime Zones. I wish this was something we could fight later down the road as I would like to take my kids to the many nice parks in this town, but I do not feel comfortable in such a public place with so many potentials for violence.
I especially enjoy the trails in Pioneers Park, but the nature trails can get quite remote, and as anyone living here knows, Wilderness Park Trails are a blast, but have become a haven for SICKOS! Someone asked me once, 'Why would you need to carry a gun while playing with your kids at the park?" Well what better an opportunity than a expansive piece of ground, with many trees, buildings, etc. behind which to accost someone. Even the parks with playgrounds, they can get so busy that it would be too easy to grab a kid and go!
Are these type of city restrictions something we could take on in the future?

rluening · « **Reply #7 on:** February 27, 2012, 05:00:53 PM »

I've noticed several Omaha parks with these signs. I've also noticed that almost every one of them has at least one "official" entrance that is not posted, not to mention the fact that you can enter or exit most parks at many points between the actual entrances.

I don't think they meet the legal requirements. I also don't want to be the test case.

/rl

RLMoeller · « **Reply #8 on:** February 27, 2012, 05:31:05 PM »

It's been awhile, but the Omaha park near me is only posted by the pool entrance, not the rest of the park.

SemperFiGuy · « **Reply #9 on:** February 27, 2012, 06:19:49 PM »

Let's Try This One On For Size:

Nebraska State Statute 18-1703.
Ownership, possession, and transportation of concealed handguns; power of cities and villages; existing ordinance, permit, or regulation; null and void.

Cities and villages shall not have the power to regulate the ownership, possession, or transportation of a concealed handgun, as such ownership, possession, or transportation is authorized under the Concealed Handgun Permit Act, except as expressly provided by state law, and shall not have the power to require registration of a concealed handgun owned, possessed, or transported by a permitholder under the act. Any existing city or village ordinance, permit, or regulation regulating the ownership, possession, or transportation of a concealed handgun, as such ownership, possession, or transportation is authorized under the act, except as expressly provided under state law, and any existing city or village ordinance, permit, or regulation requiring the registration of a concealed handgun owned, possessed, or transported by a permitholder under the act, is declared to be null and void as against any permitholder possessing a valid permit under the act.
Source:Laws 2009, LB430, § 5; Laws 2010, LB817, § 2.

Cross References: Concealed Handgun Permit Act, see section 69-2427.

Some time ago I called the Omaha City Prosecutor's Office about this Carry Concealed in the Parks issue. Talked to a nice lady lawyer. She told me that--after consultation around her office w/other city attorneys--there was no city ordinance prohibiting concealed carry in the the City of Omaha parks.

She did indicate that the parks could be posted against concealed carry by the city, but because of the infinite entrance points, such posting would be difficult to enforce.

Like others, I don't want to be the test case. Maybe we should get AndyAllen or DanW set up for packing and push them through the park. See what happens. Leadership has its responsibilities.

sfg

Mudinyeri · « **Reply #10 on:** February 27, 2012, 07:08:34 PM »

So, a business can post a "criminals welcome" sign but the city can't?

NE Bull · « **Reply #11 on:** February 27, 2012, 07:12:48 PM »

Quote

Like others, I don't want to be the test case. Maybe we should get AndyAllen or DanW set up for packing and push them through the park. See what happens. Leadership has its responsibilities.

I think this is where we need volunteerism from the membership.

If we send AAllen out for a stroll in the park, the city and OPD would quickly assess it as a set-up and just leave him be.

I would like to think they have learned not to poke the bear that is the NFOA!

Ross Berck · « **Reply #12 on:** February 27, 2012, 07:30:48 PM »

Democracy park.........pathetic...rename it democrat park

DanClrk51 · « **Reply #13 on:** February 27, 2012, 08:26:06 PM »

Is the city not pre-empted from banning ccw on city property because of the CHP Act pre-emption language?

AAllen · « **Reply #14 on:** February 27, 2012, 08:28:25 PM »

OK, I have to admit that I already have carried my firearm concealed in an Omaha park. But I don't do anything wrong to have the police come by and question me so nobody knows...

Of course I have also open carried without getting any notice.

AAllen · « **Reply #15 on:** February 27, 2012, 08:29:58 PM »

Quote from: DanClrk51 on February 27, 2012, 08:26:06 PM

Is the city not pre-empted from banning ccw on city property because of the CHP Act pre-emption language?

No they can post facilities like a business, but an ordinance would have no effect without the posting.

DanClrk51 · « **Reply #16 on:** February 27, 2012, 11:23:02 PM »

Thats another loophole we need to fix sometime. Hopefully in the future we will be able to pass a law with FULL state pre-emption of all gun laws just like it is in Florida meaning that counties, cities, villages, towns and any other local govt cannot have laws on the books nor post signs regulating firearms in any way shape or form.

Husker_Fan · « **Reply #17 on:** February 28, 2012, 09:16:03 AM »

Andy,
Where does the CHL statute let a city post its property like a business?

Dan W · « **Reply #18 on:** February 28, 2012, 07:04:30 PM »

018.04
A person, entity, or employer in control of a place or premises described in Section 018.01O above, which is open to the public, may prohibit permit holders from carrying concealed handguns in the place or premises by posting a conspicuous notice that carrying a concealed handgun is prohibited in or on the place or premises or by making a request, directly or through an authorized representative or management personnel, that the permit holder remove the concealed handgun from the place or premises.

018.05
State law does not mandate a specific requirement for a sign other than that it be conspicuously posted, however, the Nebraska State Patrol strongly suggests that a standardized format be utilized. The standardized form should contain a four (4) inch circle with a slash covering a handgun and text giving notice that carrying a concealed handgun anywhere on the premises is prohibited. A form will be available on the Nebraska State Patrol website which can be downloaded for printing. The Nebraska State Patrol also strongly recommends that a place or premises wishing to prohibit concealed handguns post the sign at normal eye level at each public entrance to the place or premises. Normal eye level is considered to be between 54” and 66” from the floor.

018.06
Except as prohibited by federal law, a permit holder may carry a concealed handgun in a vehicle or on his or her person while riding in or on a vehicle into or onto any parking area which is open to the public and used by any of the places or premises listed in Section 018.01 above if the handgun is not removed from the vehicle and the handgun is properly secured in the vehicle before the permit holder exits the vehicle. To be properly secured in the vehicle, the handgun must be locked inside the glove box, trunk or other compartment of the vehicle, in a storage box attached to the vehicle, or in a securely attached hardened compartment if the vehicle is a motorcycle.

Husker_Fan · « **Reply #19 on:** February 28, 2012, 07:57:23 PM »

Dan,
I may be completely wrong, but my interpretation of 18-1703 would mean the city cannot ban concealed carry in parks. Under the original act, cities could post property, but after preemption, I think the city is restrained from prohibiting guns anywhere where the act doesn't prohibit them.

I usually have no use for them since they have no binding effect, but it may be worth it to ask the AG's office for its opinion.