A question about what CCW training should be....

[Gary]

As the paperwork gets filed to get the licenses, having 50 people all claim the same date, time, and instructor would be pretty odious.  How could you run 50 people through a target range, and have class instruction, all in one day with one guy teaching the class???  I think this was misunderstood by you over the beers??? & you stated YOU did not take the class.

What we need is calm heads as we watch Obama and his minions try to strip us of all our Second Amendments privileges.  Having to obtain a CCP is an infringement on my rights already, and having an open discussion from persons sitting at a bar spill out onto this forum serves us how exactly???

If the husband wants his money back for the class, I am sure the instructor would be glad to do that for you.   If on the other hand, you are using the certification gleaned from taking that class, I am guessing any refund would be having your cake and eating it too.

My class is this Sunday, and by chance, your instructor, is my instructor, I will learn all I can, and pay my inappropriate tax to the gov for a privilege the 2nd Amendment already granted me, on December 15, 1791

 

I don't envy the guys that teach these classes.  This class ranged from a couple girls that started shooting a pistol 1 week ago up to guys that are 50 yrs old and have been shooting for a lifetime.   I wasn't there for much of it, basically just the last 30 minutes while they ran through the targets.  There was no berm, no safe area, and half the people didn't have holsters for their weapons. 

When they first scheduled this class the guy had 50 signed up and only reduced it to 25 after he got busted at a class a couple weeks ago for being way over his limit.   I'm not as concerned about anyone being taught all the ins and outs of CCW, I know it can't be done in one class.  My concern is with this being a pencil-whipped money generator.  I think it reflects poorly on all of us. 

[bullit]

Gary we look forward to your report...just make certain you at least get a badge if your disappointed

[Chris Z]

I can assure you this wasn't my class....... We take about a 9 hour day (3 of which are spent on the range). There is no possible way to run 25 people through the class properly and meet the required objectives in 5 hours..... This Instructor makes us all look bad and NSP needs to know about this...........

There was another Instructor recently who was doing an incredible half ass job on the range, allowing unsafe, uncontrolled gun handling all over the place, not following any bit of his submitted plan and did not even know the state required range qualification...... It wasn't real humorous for him when NSP showed up to audit his class.

[NB]

I was at Scheel's Omaha tonight.  I suppose I learned a thing or two but it was mostly common sense stuff.  Was the class good or bad?  I don't know.  I have been to a total of one, and the reason I went is so I could get my permit.  If I get a permit, then the class has served it's purpose.  The only disappointment is that this class didn't add on the Utah kicker, which I wasn't aware of when I signed up.

Hapkido has it right.  If your expectation is to learn how to properly handle a firearm, then CCW is not the right forum.  You should already know that before you show up.  Furthermore, if your expectation is to learn the "legality" of conceal carry, then I guess you can learn a little bit, but what I got out of it is that there is so much grey area that legality is never black and white.  6 hours of "what-if" scenarios would not have made it any clearer.

At the end of the day, I'm not getting my panties in a bunch over some noob getting a CCW permit that doesn't deserve one.  This class is the means to the end, which is that slip of paper the state patrol gives to me.

[Gary]

Don't think I will go for a badge, but as a joke, I could tell my wife she HAS TO WEAR ONE, and drive with her 4 way flashers on, while she has a concealed weapon in her car!  lol  She is pretty gullible, even after 30 years of marriage to me.   I think all people with good hearts are gullible.

Gary we look forward to your report...just make certain you at least get a badge if your disappointed

[Gary]

For my class, I hope and pray, no audit takes place, as I really just want to get this infringement of my Second Amendment rights, over and done with.

I have owned guns so long, my first riffle was $18, and my first handgun was $29, if that tells you anything.  Long time ago.

My first CCP was 30 years ago, no, longer.  Maybe 35 years ago.   I am sure much has changed, but mostly the politics of it all. 

My wife has never handled many guns, shot her first handgun this week, bless her heart, she did real good.

My hope for this class, is it follows the path of least resistance, and is over and done with in the minimum time allowed by state law, no one is injured, no one flunks, and lunch is served with Mt. Dew. 

When it is over, I will not complain, gripe, or fuss, as long as the goal is achieved, of this being over.

I have been a life member of NRA from 1991.  I am a retired gun dealer.  In all my years of dealing guns, no surprises, no big moments, and I would like to keep it that way. 

I can assure you this wasn't my class....... We take about a 9 hour day (3 of which are spent on the range). There is no possible way to run 25 people through the class properly and meet the required objectives in 5 hours..... This Instructor makes us all look bad and NSP needs to know about this...........

There was another Instructor recently who was doing an incredible half ass job on the range, allowing unsafe, uncontrolled gun handling all over the place, not following any bit of his submitted plan and did not even know the state required range qualification...... It wasn't real humorous for him when NSP showed up to audit his class.

[Gary]

Very good post, or at least, it rang my bell.  My feelings exactly!

If I move my business to Vermont, do you know what I need to do to carry a Concealed Weapon on my person?  Nothing.  Why is Nebraska so afraid of a US citizen exercising my rights to a complete and straight forward Second Amendment?

I was at Scheel's Omaha tonight.  I suppose I learned a thing or two but it was mostly common sense stuff.  Was the class good or bad?  I don't know.  I have been to a total of one, and the reason I went is so I could get my permit.  If I get a permit, then the class has served it's purpose.  The only disappointment is that this class didn't add on the Utah kicker, which I wasn't aware of when I signed up.

Hapkido has it right.  If your expectation is to learn how to properly handle a firearm, then CCW is not the right forum.  You should already know that before you show up.  Furthermore, if your expectation is to learn the "legality" of conceal carry, then I guess you can learn a little bit, but what I got out of it is that there is so much grey area that legality is never black and white.  6 hours of "what-if" scenarios would not have made it any clearer.

At the end of the day, I'm not getting my panties in a bunch over some noob getting a CCW permit that doesn't deserve one.  This class is the means to the end, which is that slip of paper the state patrol gives to me.

[DaveB]

My son and I took CHP training a couple of years ago at Great Plains Rifle LLC. near Bruno NE, near Abie NE. In other words, near nothing but farmland. The rural atmosphere contributed to a relaxing day.
The class was well prepared, covered what the Statute requires, the class size was 12 people max. the setting was in a small gun store where you could buy ammo if you didn't bring enough, and the shooting portion was right out the back of the store to a small range.
The 2 instructors are husband and wife and are retired NSP, tuition included pizza lunch, the training was not hurried, and I really felt the shooting portion was handled safely.
Call this a shameless plug, but we were very satisfied.

Greg58

http://greatplainsllc.com/ccwtraining.aspx

Same place we went, was an awesome job, friendly, and knew what they were talking about.

[Phantom]

I also was at the Class given at Scheel's here in Omaha Last night

Our Class was taught By Larry Moody

I have to echo others here in this forum it was not a beginner level class
It assumes that the student has at least a very general familiarity with guns and gun usage.

Our class touched On federal, state and a bit on local laws in regards to conceded carry and gun ownership, as well as some of the responsibility's associated with each.

He actually demonstrated several Role playing scenario's too.

he went into handgun types and had examples of both that he passed around for the class to examine

he went through a bit on round care and inspection as well as handling safety and some hazards associated with handling the rounds/(bullets) 

I thought he was a very approachable instructor and was very willing to answer questions regarding a wide range of questions relating to class materials.

The class size was about 20 to 22 people.  (sorry i didn't think to count heads at the time)

At the End of the Classroom Section we all took the (I what i was told was the States) 30 question test. 
It appeared to me that everyone there at least passed the test.

I was supprised that the Range part will not be held at the Bullet hole like their web site says but will be at a private location near 192 and state street.

It will be conducted over 3 days this week.

He seemed to be very knowledgeable and very willing to share that knowledge with the class.
the only point he seemed to be unaware of was the State requirement of 45 days for approving or denying a CCW permit.  he quoted that times were running about 68 days to process them.

I informed him about the requirement or 45 day under State law but did say that some times the people working in the State patrol offices may be unaware of this requirement under state law.       

I was actually very pleasantly supprised by the level of knowledge I've gained here in the forum in regards to Nebraska state CCW laws, regulations and requirement's associated with it.

I would be willing to recommend Larry to others for training as i thought he did a very good job presenting the info and engaging the class he was very humorous and told several funny story's and tales that were related to the class material at the time.

This is the first time i've actual attempted to write a review on any subect so i hope that I've done a resonable and factual job on it. 


thanks
Phantom
 

     

[bullit]

A REAL HELPFUL resource I would refer EVERYONE with questions about the course they have taken or will take is the NSP website which has all pertinent information as well as what instructors are required to teach in the class and the range.  I know most of here are men and reading instructions/directions is foreign to us. An example would be the following:

027 TRAINING COURSE CONTENT

027.01 The instructor of a Handgun Training and Safety Course is required to provide a Handgun Training and Safety Course Lesson Plan to Nebraska State Patrol. Before it can be used, the Lesson Plan must meet the minimum standards for the course and be approved by the Nebraska State Patrol. Significant deviation from a lesson plan is unacceptable and will result in the revocation of the instructor’s certification. Additionally, deviations may result in rejection of student’s permit application.
027.02 The following will be the minimum information instructed to the participants of any Handgun Training and Safety Course. Any training above and beyond the Lesson Plan is the sole responsibility of the instructor. An instructor may supplement the Lesson Plan but may not teach material which is inconsistent with the plan.
027.03 The minimum safety and training requirements for a Handgun Training and Safety Course shall include, but not be limited to:
027.03A Knowledge of ways to avoid a criminal attack and to defuse or control a violent confrontation;
027.03B Knowledge and safe handling of a handgun;
027.03C Knowledge and safe handling of handgun ammunition;
027.03D Knowledge of proper storage practices for handguns and ammunition, including storage practices which would reduce the possibility of accidental injury to a child;
027.03E Safe handgun shooting fundamentals;
027.03F Knowledge of federal, state, and local laws pertaining to the purchase, ownership, transportation, and possession of handguns;
027.03G Knowledge of federal, state, and local laws pertaining to the use of a handgun, including, but not limited to, use of a handgun for self-defense and laws relating to justifiable homicide and the various degrees of assault;
027.04 Applicants must demonstrate competency in handling and shooting a handgun with respect to the minimum safety and training requirements;
027.04A Students shall complete practical exercises which include practice shooting on the range. These exercises will include but are not limited to the following; drawing and firing drills, precision shooting drills, and decision making (shoot-don’t
23
shoot) drills. The number of rounds to be fired in practice by each student will be determined by the instructor.
027.04B The Nebraska State Patrol shall set the qualification course for the demonstration of competency. The course shall be 30 rounds with varying distances. The target used shall be the FBI “Q” target. A score of 70 percent will be the minimum to demonstrate competency. Participants in the Handgun Training and Safety Course will be allowed three attempts to demonstrate competency, meeting the minimum standards.
027.04C Qualification Course
Distance Number of Rounds Time limit
3 feet Six (6) N/A
** Two rounds per command to fire. One (1) repetition must be from a concealed draw**
9 feet Twelve (12) N/A
** Two rounds per command to fire. Three (3) repetitions must be from a concealed draw**
15 feet Six (6) N/A
** Two rounds per command to fire. One (1)) repetition must be from a concealed draw**
21 feet Six (6) N/A
** Two rounds per command to fire. One (1) repetition must be from a concealed draw**
027.05 Applicants must take a written test consisting of a minimum of 30 questions. The Nebraska State Patrol will provide the test questions. A score of 70 percent will be the minimum passing score.

[GreyGeek]

Interesting, bullit!
I can put a check mark beside each bullet point for my training.   I thought the range portion was very good.

[stutzcattle]

I can assure you this wasn't my class....... We take about a 9 hour day (3 of which are spent on the range). There is no possible way to run 25 people through the class properly and meet the required objectives in 5 hours..... This Instructor makes us all look bad and NSP needs to know about this...........

There was another Instructor recently who was doing an incredible half ass job on the range, allowing unsafe, uncontrolled gun handling all over the place, not following any bit of his submitted plan and did not even know the state required range qualification...... It wasn't real humorous for him when NSP showed up to audit his class.

I took my class with you about five years ago.  I remember it lasting all day.  This is what struck me. 

I'm posting this not to hurt some instructor or to see him audited.  I also feel that we should have constitutional carry. 
I'm concerned that some of these people are out there simply to generate money right now.  I'm a capitalist and believe in making as much as possible.  But...If you're gonna charge the same amt as the guy that's teaching 4 more hours and covering twice as much info you're doing a disservice to the students.  I think this guy making $3k on one class is fine.   If he does everything he's supposed to. 

I'm not going to bring this to the SP's attention.  I don't want 25 armed people looking for me.  Firearms safety is something they should know or be in the process of learning.  That's all that should really matter anyway.

[stutzcattle]

Is there a time requirement for these classes?

[JTH]

Is there a time requirement for these classes?

No....BUT the instructor must cover the mandated material given in the State Patrol regulations.

So if the teacher has any shred of self-respect, there is a certain minimum time in class required. 

And, IN MY OPINION, there is no way to do anything remotely resembling a good job in a 5-hour class where that 5 hours includes range time.

[Phantom]

Well i Finished my class today

I only did one rookie mistake on the range (it wasn't a safety violation at least)
I used my brothers Xd40 to do the range part and had never fired it before.
I know I'm going to get no end of grief from the mistake I made.
I misplaced my left thumb when i first fired it.
Yea It bit me ...cut my thumb ....no big deal it just bled .....
I shot the rest of the rounds in the mag..then got a paper towel to wrap my thumb
and shot the rest of the course no problem.

all done and passed.
I was sure happy to be using a .40 rather then a 9mm like everyone else was as ammo was much easier to find for it. 

All done with that part course finished now.
Now i just need to finish filling out the paperwork and visit a notary
then take it and my fee out to the Highway patrol office and get finger printed again.
Submit it all and pay the fee.
Then comes the 45 day wait.
I'll get it done this week or sometime next week at the latest.


Phantom

[Gary]

Glad your thumb did not go flying across the room.  Some woman taking pole dancing lessons lost a thumb!  ouch. 

[Jutty]

the only point he seemed to be unaware of was the State requirement of 45 days for approving or denying a CCW permit.  he quoted that times were running about 68 days to process them.

I informed him about the requirement or 45 day under State law but did say that some times the people working in the State patrol offices may be unaware of this requirement under state law.       

I am sure they are very aware of it (by people calling and asking where their permit is). The big issue is, by this law, what is the penalty to NSP if they DON'T get it done in 45 days?

Hint: There is none...

[LM4202]

I took Chris Z's class and its just fine.  The CHP class is NOT a beginners class.  The students should have that down before even taking the CHP course.     

[Lorimor]

I was actually very pleasantly supprised by the level of knowledge I've gained here in the forum in regards to Nebraska state CCW laws, regulations and requirement's associated with it.

Some pretty knowledgeable folks here.  I urge you to take advantage of that and take their classes. 

[zofoman]

The CHP class is NOT a beginners class.  The students should have that down before even taking the CHP course.     

This is true.   Granted, people have to start somewhere....learning basic handgun skills at a CCW class is not the place.  There are many places one can get the basics down in a safe and knowledgeable manner before moving on.    Even though I live in Lincoln, I did my CCW class at 88-Tactical as did my oldest son....followed up by the Utah permit session at a later date.    Jason Wright was the instructor for both.  Their classes are held in one day or two day sessions....depending.   And they are full days, no quick in/out stuff and with limited attendance so as to better manage & effectively teach the classes.   The facility they have at Tekamah is outstanding.  I took my classroom session at their offices in Omaha whereas the range portion was at Tekamah.   My oldest son has followed up by taking many of their continued training courses as well.   My youngest son recently completed his CCW at Big Shots and in our three-way discussion/comparing what was taught by the two different venues we concluded that both were excellent...but, would give the edge to 88-Tactical because of the "extra" training/scenarios/responses.   If you are not familiar with these folks, they just launched a new website... http://88tactical.com/    They offer a variety of different classes for beginners, ladies only, tactical and my personal favorite, "Guardian Series" of training for children...ie: Anti Bully/ Anti Abduction Course.   My two grandchildren (F/age 10 & M/age 6) took the "Fast Cats" course and it was well worth it based on what I saw from the videos that my son recorded.