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Author Topic: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?  (Read 2506 times)

Offline JTH

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Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« on: June 23, 2014, 02:09:51 PM »
Do you remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions, including lots of commentary about how that stuff will get you killed?

I remember.  Believe me, he does it all the time.

And yet....

(from his newsletter/advertising spam today)

"SUAREZ INTERNATIONAL - COMPETITIVE SHOOTING
 
I want to welcome Russell Phagan aboard as our Southern Arizona Competitive Shooting Affiliate and Suarez international Specialist Instructor. You know Russell as sinistralrifleman, and he has been a Suarez-Sponsored competitive shooter for several years. He has distinguished himself in various high profile championships using our gear and wearing our logo.

Russell will be collaborating with Randy Harris, and Alex Nieuwland, another successful competitor, in presenting various competition shooting courses later this year and into 2015. 

This new series of classes will deal exclusively with the sport of Competitive Shooting. The courses and disciplines themselves will be announced later, but will range from "being tactical while being competitive", to full out "win the race" type topics. More to follow in that area."


Apparently, he twigged to the fact that competition shooters spend lots of money.  So now he's got an officially sponsored "team" and is allowing (and planning even more) competition classes.

Matter of fact, apparently he's sponsored a competition shooter for quite some time.  Huh, so he thinks that stuff will get you killed, but he'll still pay for someone to advertise for him while doing it.

And now there will be official Suarez classes in it.

Amazing how that works.


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Offline bkoenig

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #1 on: June 23, 2014, 05:58:46 PM »
Oh, you mean this Gabe Suarez?

http://www.smoothcheeks.com/About_Gabriel.html

Quote
Gabriel Suarez is a licensed esthetician, specializing in skin care services and waxing from head to toe. He has met the beauty treatment needs of West Hollywood residents for over seven years, working for some of the most recognizable salons in the city. He brings extensive post-graduate training from the International Dermal Institute to his table. He values his clients, making sure they are treated with quality care.


 ???

Or the one who was convicted of money laundering, workman's comp fraud, etc?  By the way, how exactly does he teach shooting classes?  Isn't he a felon?

Offline Gunscribe

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #2 on: June 23, 2014, 06:27:52 PM »
bk, I was not aware of that appreciate it. He is not listed as one of the instructors, so he may own the company but can not participate.
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Offline billzz

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2014, 09:50:26 PM »
Never heard of him.

Offline bullit

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2014, 06:53:13 AM »
Or the one who was convicted of money laundering, workman's comp fraud, etc?  By the way, how exactly does he teach shooting classes?  Isn't he a felon?

Seriously BK?  Please elaborate .... 

Offline on the fritz

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #5 on: June 24, 2014, 08:28:59 AM »

Offline JTH

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #6 on: June 24, 2014, 09:33:16 AM »
He's not a felon.  He plead down to misdemeanor charges, then spent close to a year in a county jail.

If you do a search on "Gabe Suarez felon" you'll get a TON of links discussing the whole thing from all angles.  You'll see almost immediately a significant difference between his story (as told by him and his supporters) and the story told by the judicial system.

My personal opinion about him is fairly low. 

My professional opinion about him is that a number of years ago, his contributions to firearms training were significant, particularly in the area of close-quarters work, and integrating force-on-force into standard classes.  However, as the training community has changed and improved over time, he hasn't necessarily kept up with them, and has unfortunately developed a "cult of personality" exemplified by his forum in which his pronouncements are treated as gospel, and if people disagree with him, they are wrong.  (You'll see what I mean if you go there and read for awhile.)

I think more highly of Suarez than I do Pincus (that's setting the bar remarkably low, though), but it does seem interesting to me how often in his newsletter he supports some new piece of equipment as a "must have" once he is able to sell it, but not before then.

For people who haven't done any defensive tactics or close-quarters classes, his courses (from the AARs I've seen, plus his books and DVDs---note, I haven't BEEN in one of his classes, so I may be wrong) are perfectly decent and cover a fairly standard curriculum.  However, they are more technique classes than tactics classes, and several of his contentions about close-quarters work (based on what he's found in force-on-force) other people (and I) disagree with pretty significantly.

If you watch some of the youtube videos available, you'll see why---for example, he promulgates the idea that if someone comes at you with a knife, running backward while shooting over your shoulder one-handed is the best idea, because that's the only way in his force-on-force class you don't get sliced.

Of course, in that class, the attacker doesn't stop when struck by airsoft pellets, so of course you can't do anything but run away.  However, Suarez says that's the ONLY way to survive.  (Quite loudly.) 

So, in my opinion, Suarez taught some good basic CQT, and got force-on-force really started in standard classes (as opposed to LEO-only or military-only classes) but has moved on to some conclusions based on them that I just don't think logically follow.

Your mileage may vary.  :)

In the past, he CERTAINLY has had an opinion about competition shooting, which folks have posted here on the forums in the past.

Lots of people have taken his classes.  He was the guy recently who was quoted saying:  "This is about killing, and killing is simple. So many non-killers teaching killing these days. Ask a killer what works best."  Yeah, I posted an opinion about that.

Amusingly enough, awhile back sjwsti posted an article titled "Avoiding the Gamer Trap" written by the Suarez guy who is NOW one of the guys in charge of teaching competition shooting classes for Suarez. 

Nice.
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Offline sjwsti

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #7 on: June 24, 2014, 02:38:35 PM »
Amusingly enough, awhile back sjwsti posted an article titled "Avoiding the Gamer Trap" written by the Suarez guy who is NOW one of the guys in charge of teaching competition shooting classes for Suarez. 

Nice.

Alex Nieuwland wrote the article you are referring to and Im guessing will be instructing the  "being tactical while being competitive" course for Suarez. If you read the article he lays out some good guidelines on how to forget about winning the little plastic trophy and use competition shooting to work on defensive skills. It sure doesnt sound like a "competition" course in the classic sense to me and seems to fit in with what Suarez teaches. So you are right JT, it is Nice. So Nice in fact, here is the link for anyone that missed it the first time.

http://blog.suarezinternational.com/2011/07/avoiding-the-gamer-trap.html#.U6nPdPk7uQo

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Offline bullit

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #8 on: June 24, 2014, 03:44:26 PM »
"Nice"..... no wonder Nebraska tourism made this the new state slogan.....

Offline JTH

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #9 on: June 24, 2014, 04:20:12 PM »
Alex Nieuwland wrote the article you are referring to and Im guessing will be instructing the  "being tactical while being competitive" course for Suarez. If you read the article he lays out some good guidelines on how to forget about winning the little plastic trophy and use competition shooting to work on defensive skills. It sure doesnt sound like a "competition" course in the classic sense to me and seems to fit in with what Suarez teaches. So you are right JT, it is Nice. So Nice in fact, here is the link for anyone that missed it the first time.

http://blog.suarezinternational.com/2011/07/avoiding-the-gamer-trap.html#.U6nPdPk7uQo

Apparently you missed the part where he said: "The courses and disciplines themselves will be announced later, but will range from "being tactical while being competitive", to full out "win the race" type topics."

And I read the article, plus others he has written.  And if you recall, I had quite a bit to say about it, bringing in commentary from lots of other shooters who have to use their skills in real-world situations all the time---who thoroughly enjoy competition shooting, and don't see the problem that Nieuwland did.  Which is interesting, because Nieuwland doesn't win nearly as often as they do...

Quote
how to forget about winning the little plastic trophy and use competition shooting to work on defensive skills

Seriously?  That's what you got out of it?  From Phagan, who makes a big deal about being a serious 3-gunner?  Or Nieuwland, who used to shoot IDPA, but isn't even an IDPA member anymore?

It'll be interesting to see how they teach "win the race" classes, since while Phagan sometimes places in Trooper division, he doesn't win much, and Nieuwland isn't even an IDPA or a USPSA member.  (Which is interesting, because he's still shooting IDPA matches, though he doesn't win there either.)

You did catch the part where they said they'd be teaching full out win the race classes, right, Shawn?  And the part where they talk about "being competitive," which, one assumes, IS about winning?
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Offline sjwsti

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #10 on: June 24, 2014, 04:22:50 PM »
"Nice"..... no wonder Nebraska tourism made this the new state slogan.....

 :laugh: Well played, Sir.

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Offline Lorimor

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Re: Remember how Suarez always bags on shooting competitions?
« Reply #11 on: June 24, 2014, 07:29:00 PM »
Reading this thread will get you killed on the streets.  :)
"It is better to avoid than to run; better to run than to de-escalate; better to de-escalate than to fight; better to fight than to die. The very essence of self-defense is a thin list of things that might get you out alive when you are already screwed." – Rory Miller