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Author Topic: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options  (Read 4068 times)

Offline RN4Guns

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AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« on: February 09, 2015, 08:40:27 PM »
Here is my AAR on the last presentation during NRA Days at Cabelas:

This weekend I was at Cabelas representing The Omaha Chapter of The Well Armed Woman. It was NRA days and several vendors were set up. ENGC, Take Aim and the LaVista Police were among those represented.

Towards the end of the day Sunday, a gentleman who stated he was representing the NRA came up to our table. We were curious to his topic that he was presenting: “Ladies Concealed and Carry Options”. We asked him what holsters he would be demonstrating and presenting. He gruffly told us that he wasn’t going to be discussing holsters but instead talk to the ladies about how serious it is to carry concealed. He did ask us if we would like to join in the conversation to give the ladies point of view. Of course we accepted!

It was time for the presentation. He was allotted an hour to present his information. I, along with another member sat in the back row. The presentation was held in front of the taxidermy display in the middle of the store. Prior to starting the presentation the gentleman made a comment that he was going to present and then include another training team that was there as well.

The first words out of the NRA guys mouth was, “Ladies, the statistics show that most women will be killed with their own guns”. WHAT? SMH..did I just hear that right? I knew I had heard that statistic before. HMMM..oh yeah, I remember now. It was a statistic used my MDA and Shannon Watts. Wait, but why the heck is this representative of the NRA giving this false statistic?

He listed his credentials as a retired cop. He also seemed to use the fact that he knew the now deceased owner of the gun shop “She’s a Pistol”. He stated that he was responsible for training Becky and John and getting them started in the gun business. Disrespectfully he mentioned that Becky was not prepared and that she hesitated. Even though he then stated he wasn’t there but that most likely is what happened.

He then finished off his portion with a story. He told the ladies about the time when he was in plain clothes and was held at gunpoint. I believe at one point he said his grandkids were with him. He then went on to say that normally he didn’t keep any cash in his wallet. So he then started demonstrating how he held up his hands in a motion to surrender. He then stated he said the following to the armed man. “Mister I will give you all my money and credit cards. Let me give them too you.” He then started motioning like he was getting his wallet out of his back pocket. He then stopped with his right hand on his back pocket and said with a smile, “I wasn’t carrying my wallet on my right side.” He then went on to say that he pointed his gun at the armed man and demanded that he throw his gun off to the side and he held him until police arrived. Moral of the story-Ladies…if you are threatened by an armed man, pretend you have some money in your back pocket and then grab your gun and point it right back at the armed man. Then using all your experience watching cop shows, tells the armed man to get on the ground and throw your gun to the side. Ok, so that is my take on the moral of the story.

Here is the kicker that I saved for last. He also said that he never carries a round in the chamber for this reason-if the bad guy gets the gun, I will be able to grab it back before he has a chance to chamber a round. I s**t you not! Oh I also forgot, he did state that you need at least 600 hours of training..not sure if that was over your lifetime or yearly. I better quit my day job and start training!

Now we have our second group up. Two gentlemen from Sight Picture Squeeze were called to the front. They started with their credentials. I think one was LEO and the other a Marine. My brain was still hurting from the previous presenter so some of the facts with these guys are fuzzy. All I remember is that they talked about the training they offered and how they only advertise word of mouth because they do not want to just ‘rack up the numbers’. Next topic they mentioned was about the CHP class and that anyone can punch holes on paper but that their training would make you better. Then out of nowhere, one of the men said, “Any questions”? The ladies on the audience (about 15 of them) sat there in silence. I was sitting in the back row so could not directly see anyone’s face. The women sat motionless, almost frozen in fear I would guess—just my opinion. The older gentlemen then said how many of you are experienced? I had to do it, I just couldn’t sit still and leave this group of women to feel scared and walk away with such dangerous information. I took the opportunity to stand up as soon as he acknowledged that my hand was up. I kinda just stood up and started speaking about resources for women and that firearms are just one tool in their toolbox and that education and training is key. Training from a professional and knowledgeable instructor. I spoke for about 5 minutes and then unfortunately had to leave for a family event. Now in retrospect, the 2 guys in the front had a look of fear in their eyes when I just started walking and talking to the ladies. I have a feeling they didn’t get the memo that I was asked to also speak on women’s holster options  :D


Offline OnTheFly

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #1 on: February 09, 2015, 09:06:35 PM »
Oy vey!  How demeaning.  This sounds like a big deterrent to any women that came to this event.  Considering that the world of firearms is (or at least is perceived as) a majority of white males, attempting to become a new gun owner as a minority or woman can be quite daunting.  We don't need this machismo BS.

Fly
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Offline Dan W

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #2 on: February 09, 2015, 09:10:15 PM »
Jeez...good thing you were there to roll back some of the BS...Good Job!
Dan W    NFOA Co Founder
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Offline jFader

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #3 on: February 09, 2015, 10:06:38 PM »
That is reDamnDiculous!  We should get a hold of someone & find out who that bozo is & call his superiors!  Who knows, maybe he was on the payroll of Moms Demand Gun Confiscation with a presentation like that....
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Offline bullit

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #4 on: February 10, 2015, 07:40:30 AM »
Forget about the "male v. female" issue ... the first presenter sounds like genuine BUFFOON ...... 

Offline FarmerRick

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #5 on: February 10, 2015, 08:01:31 AM »
Though I did read it all... all I really needed to read was "NRA day at Cabelas"     :(

Glad you were there to set a few people straight.
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Offline Lorimor

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #6 on: February 10, 2015, 08:03:07 AM »
Couldn't the organizers of this event find some REAL experts?  Those guys sound like real gunshop commandos. 

They sounded like they were just looking for an audience to tout their worldly ways.  :(

Bozos. 

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Offline Mali

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #7 on: February 10, 2015, 10:02:05 AM »
Very glad I didn't take my wife.  She is still getting comfortable with guns in the house and is showing signs of being interested but this would have been a MAJOR setback.
Thank you for trying to get some damage control in there.  Hard to believe he represented the NRA. *shudder*
Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same. - Ronald Reagan

Offline bullit

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #8 on: February 10, 2015, 11:29:13 AM »
Though I did read it all... all I really needed to read was "NRA day at Cabelas"    
.


You always give the best perspective ....

Offline bkoenig

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #9 on: February 10, 2015, 11:58:46 AM »
Sounds like all that was missing was a recommendation that all women carry an Airweight S&W.

Offline greg58

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2015, 07:13:39 PM »
Teresa, sorry you ran into Mr. Condesending with the first speaker. I'm suprised you were able to keep still!
Were the 2 men from Sight, Picture, Squeeze better?
The reason I ask is, I recently went to a 3hr training with the LEO of that group about gang awareness for EMS providers. I found the training very interesting and his presentation informative, so I wondered how his firearm training would be.
Probably not enough time to get into anything but what they offer.
Thanks for posting.

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Offline RN4Guns

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2015, 07:32:50 PM »
Greg,

The second group was from Sight, Picture, Squeeze. Hard to evaluate. They only used the time to promote themselves and not what the topic was. At least they seemed better than the first guy. The only advice they gave was to get training. For your training they may have been great. Unfortunately not all instructors know how to teach women, yet they advertise all female classes. I have taken local classes/instruction from Chris Z and Thomas Howard and I would recommend them to every female shooter, new or experienced. Unfortunately I have taken training from others locally that were not that well versed on women's holster options or learning style.

So to answer your question Greg, I was not able to effectively evaluate them as instructors.

I do want to mention that I voiced my concerns to Kellie (contact person) at Cabelas and she was very receptive to my concerns. She is fairly new in her position and I think she just got some names from before. I am happy to report though that TWAW will be there for Ladies Day April 18th. Potentially conducting some seminars ;D

Offline OnTheFly

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2015, 09:26:50 PM »
Unfortunately not all instructors know how to teach women, yet they advertise all female classes. I have taken local classes/instruction from Chris Z and Thomas Howard and I would recommend them to every female shooter, new or experienced. Unfortunately I have taken training from others locally that were not that well versed on women's holster options or learning style.

I have instructed in one form or another since I was 19 years old.  It started with skydiving, then financial/debt advice, flight instruction, and now I teach professional pilots.  I think the very first thing a man can do to teach women, is to drop the "I'm the man" facade, and just talk to them on the same level.  Too many men (and yes...I have been guilty of this, but I'm much better now) want to impress the opposite sex rather than just teach them.  I can't say that I am versed on women's learning styles, though I do know that men and women think differently.  My approach is simply to clearly present the material and be receptive to each students individual questions/concerns.  IMHO, an instructor can present to different people with the same style as long as they are perceived as empathetic and non-threatening.  Which is exactly how I would expect Chris Z. and Thomas to be received.

It sounds like the NRA rep had more than just a testosterone problem.  It sounds like he has a prejudice against women using guns.

Fly
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Offline JTH

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #13 on: February 11, 2015, 11:45:45 AM »
I wonder how we get on the list to give a seminar at Cabelas? 

...because I'm astonished (and disgusted) at what you had to sit through.  I realize that some people can't help but tell the story they want to tell whether it is on topic or not (and whether it is true or not), but you'd think that people officially chosen to be spokespeople for their group/business in public wouldn't be IDIOTS.

As those apparently were.

Glad to hear that TWAW will be there officially for Lady's Day---right there, that's already better information than was presented at this past event.
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Offline Mali

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #14 on: February 11, 2015, 02:11:32 PM »
I wonder how we get on the list to give a seminar at Cabelas? 
I would have no qualms about taking my wife to a seminar at Cabelas if one of you were presenting since it would be factual and clear without scaring her.
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Offline UPCrawfish

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #15 on: February 11, 2015, 06:14:34 PM »
Did anyone catch the name of NRA representative ?  Was he employed by the NRA or just happen to be an NRA member contacted to 'represent'?
 

Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #16 on: February 12, 2015, 08:34:09 AM »
Did the NRA representative cite a reference for his statistic that "most women will be killed with their own guns"?

Offline JTH

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #17 on: February 12, 2015, 09:43:54 AM »
Did the NRA representative cite a reference for his statistic that "most women will be killed with their own guns"?

That's an OOHOA* statistic, commonly cited in the literature.

Granted, its the anti-gun, anti-rights, hey-let's-make-up-things-to-scare-people literature, but it is technically in the literature.



*(Out Of His Own ASSumptions)
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Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #18 on: February 12, 2015, 01:11:32 PM »
That's an OOHOA* statistic, commonly cited in the literature.

Granted, its the anti-gun, anti-rights, hey-let's-make-up-things-to-scare-people literature, but it is technically in the literature.



*(Out Of His Own ASSumptions)

I'm aware that this "fact" is commonly used in anti-gun literature. I'm looking for the empirical study that validates the statistic.

Offline JTH

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Re: AAR from NRA Days at Cabelas-Ladies Concealed Carry Options
« Reply #19 on: February 12, 2015, 01:25:18 PM »
I'm aware that this "fact" is commonly used in anti-gun literature. I'm looking for the empirical study that validates the statistic.

There isn't one, hence my comment.  There isn't a research study out there that says anything of the sort---even one in any of the slanted anti-gun "research."  (As far as I know---and I attempt to keep track of all the current research, including all the poor research being done by gun control advocates.)

It's a poor synthesis of biased thinking that has occurred from opinion articles about how "having a gun means it will be taken from you" combined with statistics on women killed in the home by their significant others with guns owned by "them."

If anyone ever hears someone spout this, PLEASE ask them directly to cite where it came from.  You'll get a GREAT expression from them---getting it on video would be fantastic.  And if they DO say something, it'll mean you can later refute them directly as whatever they say is going to be nonsense, and you can look it up and directly show they have no idea what they are talking about.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2015, 01:39:39 PM by jthhapkido »
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