Lack of Castle Doctrine

[bullit]

ORE45 ... by your number of low postings, I will assume you are new to our forum ... Welcome.  IMHO ... may I STRONGLY recommend you obtain and READ a copy of "In the Name of Self Defense" by Marc MacYoung.  In fact, I would encourage ALL gun owners who care about "self-defense" to do so. 

[Husker_Fan]

Anytime you have one person dead and another clearly being the one who caused the death, the police will have probable cause to believe it or was criminal and will likely arrest the shooter.

It may not sound fair but there has to be a way to determine if it was self defense. Another reason it is done is to remove the shooter from the situation and avoid immediate altercations with the deceased friends or family.


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[ORE45]

Anytime you have one person dead and another clearly being the one who caused the death, the police will have probable cause to believe it or was criminal and will likely arrest the shooter.

This was my initial point of view concerning the need for Nebraska Castle Doctrine-Stand Your Ground legislation, plus, providing some protection from the possible civil litigation following the criminal outcome.   

[Husker_Fan]

Having a stand your ground law won't change that. Whether or not the law applies still has to be determined by investigation.

The police won't simply take the shooters word for it at the scene.


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[ORE45]

2.why open the door?!

This will be a controversial point, yet, IMHO non-deciding point in this event.   However, the porch would be considered part of your "castle" if Nebraska had a Castle Doctrine.

[ORE45]

http://nebraskalegislature.gov/laws/statutes.php?statute=28-1409

Yes, thanks this is helpful.

[ORE45]

But if for some reason I had to it would be in a manner that that the agressor would not have instant display to it. Because now your getting into defensive situation

This is a good point.   Not holstered, but not visible would be prudent.    Brandishing a weapon is wrong.  Yet a defensive prepared posture is also prudent.   Opinions ?

[JTH]

This will be a controversial point, yet, IMHO non-deciding point in this event.   However, the porch would be considered part of your "castle" if Nebraska had a Castle Doctrine.

Why do you think this?  Can you name any state whose Castle Doctrine law includes "land outside the residence" as part of the "Castle"? (And as people have pointed out, Nebraska already has a Castle Doctrine.)

[AAllen]

This will be a controversial point, yet, IMHO non-deciding point in this event.   However, the porch would be considered part of your "castle" if Nebraska had a Castle Doctrine.

No, the porch is outside the home, so stand your ground is what you are talking about.  Now some states extend your home to include what is refered to as the curtilage which would cover that but that has nothing to do with Castle Doctrine.

[bullit]

However, the porch would be considered part of your "castle" if Nebraska had a Castle Doctrine

Mr. Wil E. Prosecutor: "Mr. ORE45 ... can you tell the court why you went out onto your porch when according to you the victim was a screaming drunk belligerent young man who you FEEL was threatening your life?  I am curious why you simply did you not stay behind your locked door and wait for the police ... if indeed you felt your life in danger?"

See how that works ?  And you get pay ALL the money you ever had/have/and ever have in an attempt have to "prove" why you did what you did ..... KILL another human being ..... "who was simply a broken hearted young man ladies and gentlemen of the jury ...."

[Gunscribe]

Peace officers will investigate every death as a homicide because it is a homicide until proven different. The investigation will determine the type of homicide; murder, self defense, suicide. Again by immediately claiming self defense you are admitting to a crime.

[farmerbob]

Personally I believe the best thing here would of been as bullitt said, stay behind lock door and call law enforcement, at least there would of been a record that you and your family felt threatened.
We have had inebriated individuals walk up to our place in the middle of nowhere, I first phone sheriff then tell them their ride is on it's way, takes law enforcement around 30 to 45 min to show up if they hurry.
When confronting them I CC , non threatening and it's something I do all the time, if my life was threatened and I had to bring gun into play, I would not of grabbed a gun just to answer the door because it's always on me.
  (edit wrong case)
Still bad idea to interject gun into argument.

[ORE45]

First Nebraska has the Castle Doctrine,

And as people have pointed out, Nebraska already has a Castle Doctrine.

As AAllen stated, Nebraska does have a Castle Doctrine.

There needs to be more clarity on this ....

Castle Doctrine - Wikipedia

"States with weak or no specific castle law

These states uphold castle doctrine in general, but may rely on case law instead of specific legislation, may enforce a duty to retreat, and may impose specific restrictions on the use of deadly force:

    District of Columbia
    Nebraska - a bill was introduced in January 2012 that allowed deadly force against a person who broke into a house or occupied vehicle or who tried to kidnap someone from a house or vehicle; however, the bill was revised to include only an affirmative defense from lawsuits pertaining to justifiable use of force.[32]"
 

US Map of Castle Doctrine States (Not Nebraska)

[AAllen]

ORE45, As one of the people who worked on the bill in 2012, please do not use Wikipedia as a source nobody excepts that as a correct or through understanding of anything.  Nebraska allows self defense in the home (Castle Doctrine) and has since 1972. The bill in 2012 was trying to expand upon those protections to include anyplace you have a legal right to be (Stand Your Ground) and add Civil Protections (there was also provisions to end the "affirmative defense" requirement, which basically says you must say you are guilty but justified).

What we got was a watered down Civil Protection but it gave a foothold.  Those who worked on the bill at that time were not happy with the outcome but sometimes we need to take what we can get, believe me I was the person that was about to go scorched earth over what happened.

Is the subject dead, no but there is a lot of other things that need to happen to make it possible to get more.  It's a matter of not putting the cart before the horse and setting things up for success.

[Dan W]

There needs to be more clarity on this

Clarity will rarely, if ever, be found in legislation, as the courts always have the final word

[tstuart34]

Hey everyone...

So joined a Nebraska glock group on FB and someone posted the article about us being 34th gun state. Someone brough up the lack of a castle doctrin and stand your ground hurting us. Becuase of this thread I was able to do a couple things...

1. Have 2 feet to stand on and say someone was wrong!
2. Solid information to give to them about the subject.
3. I was able to show what the NFOA has to offer for Nebraska Gun owners! And urged them to join!

Thanks again for everyone who has and does participate in everything here. I learn something everyday and always feel the urge to pass on what I have learned.
Thanks

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[AAllen]

Tstuart34, thanks for the note and this is why I try to explain the differences between "Castle Doctrine" and "Stand Your Ground" whenever it comes up.  This is an issue that keeps coming up and if we can keep educating people about the differences and what we have and the difficulties with the language we will some day get enough people to come together and where we need to go to make a big push, all working together with one goal and one set of language.  If everyone else joins in and helps explain the myths away and teach the language we will get there faster.