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Author Topic: Let's plan a run & gun!  (Read 4406 times)

Offline tstuart34

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #20 on: August 09, 2015, 09:13:08 PM »
Wanted to bump this back up to the top. Need to continue to talk about this!

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Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #21 on: August 10, 2015, 08:51:47 AM »
Thanks for bumping the thread.  Somehow, I missed it.

I agree.  The closer to Omaha and/or Lincoln the better.  However, I think that needs to be weighed against the following (which I believe will make for a successful event):

1. A partner with liability insurance
2. A location with varied terrain and shooting locations/positions (IMO, traditional shooting bays are not ideal for an event like this)
3. A location large enough to handle the competitors and necessary parking
4. A food vendor/partner
5. Sponsors will to attend, provide prizes & give-aways and set up & staff booths (Trek Tech Black is on board in this capacity)

I've reached out to the Old Breed Gun Club but haven't heard anything back.  They have what I would consider a near-perfect facility ... with the exception that it is about three hours from Omaha or Lincoln.

Offline tstuart34

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #22 on: August 11, 2015, 08:48:59 AM »
Thanks for bumping the thread.  Somehow, I missed it.

I agree.  The closer to Omaha and/or Lincoln the better.  However, I think that needs to be weighed against the following (which I believe will make for a successful event):

1. A partner with liability insurance
2. A location with varied terrain and shooting locations/positions (IMO, traditional shooting bays are not ideal for an event like this)
3. A location large enough to handle the competitors and necessary parking
4. A food vendor/partner
5. Sponsors will to attend, provide prizes & give-aways and set up & staff booths (Trek Tech Black is on board in this capacity)

I've reached out to the Old Breed Gun Club but haven't heard anything back.  They have what I would consider a near-perfect facility ... with the exception that it is about three hours from Omaha or Lincoln.

1. You had discussed 88 tactical? Anymore info?
2. Agreed with you opinion takes you back to #1.
3. Back to #1. You had said about limiting it to 50 competitors. Does that include event staff?
4. Depending on the location I am not sure if this is a necessary. If we feel there will be a lot of spectators then yet I would agree this is needed. If it is just shooters then I would say it is bring your own lunch.
5. If we can get sponsers to attend great! I think with some of your connections and some phone calls from event staff a really nice prize table could be had. I would say we start by looking at all the sponsors of major uspsa/3 gun nation matches and see what we can get.  We could also look at doing a gun raffle at this time maybe?

I agree with Oldbreed those guys have a amazing facility but there facility is a privately owned property. I am not sure what type of insurance they have or the owner has. Maybe try and reach out to them on Facebook or PM me and I can give the name of the VP.

Offline Waltherfan

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #23 on: August 11, 2015, 09:18:37 AM »
Although this doesn't meet the close to Omaha request, Fort Robinson (waaay out in the panhandle) would be a great place. Beautiful scenery, buttes, canyons and more. It's a state park that has hunting so one weekend of shooting shouldn't be too big of a problem plus there is lots of housing at the fort. It would have to be planned a year out to allow for room availability (it's a popular place).
http://www.stateparks.com/fort_robinson_state_park_in_nebraska.html?

Offline bkoenig

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #24 on: August 11, 2015, 09:59:14 AM »
I think a food vendor would be a very good idea, but I don't think it's a deal killer if we don't have one.  At the OK event they had a smoker set up and made pulled pork for everyone for free.  It was really nice having food onsite since we were there all day.  Having the event closer to Lincoln/Omaha would make it a lot easier to find a vendor.

Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #25 on: August 11, 2015, 11:54:48 AM »
I think a food vendor would be a very good idea, but I don't think it's a deal killer if we don't have one.  At the OK event they had a smoker set up and made pulled pork for everyone for free.  It was really nice having food onsite since we were there all day.  Having the event closer to Lincoln/Omaha would make it a lot easier to find a vendor.

I have a resource for good vendors that will travel to relatively remote locations - probably not for free but for the price of their food.

Offline AAllen

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #26 on: August 12, 2015, 12:58:28 PM »
Updated map showing properties near Bellevue Rod and gun Club that belong to the NRD that we can get use of, along with maps showing them.

Iske is about 34 acres, and there are multiple lots in the Elbow Bend area beyond just the base area.  Several of these lots have been purchased by the NRD after the flooding a couple years ago.  Rough estimate of length of run from one end to the other (Bellevue R&G Club to Northern edge of Elbow Bend) is about 10 miles.

Issues that have been brought up:

1. A partner with liability insurance: Opportunity to partner with Bellevue Rod and Gun Club, I know they have insurance (I think its NRA, most clubs do) and can get the extra coverage needed for this type of event.

2. A location with varied terrain and shooting locations/positions (IMO, traditional shooting bays are not ideal for an event like this): There is hilly terrain and wooded area's as well as access to the bays at Bellevue Rod and Gun Club.  To add to the fun there may be some swampy area's available as well as scenic routes that can be taken bordering upon the river.

3. A location large enough to handle the competitors and necessary parking: Bellevue Rod and Gun Club hosts events with over 600 shooters for High School Trap, don't think that will be much of a problem.

4. A food vendor/partner: With the many vendors available in the area this should not be an issue to secure someone, but the Gun Club also sells food in the club house for most of their events so that would need to be worked out.

5. Sponsors will to attend, provide prizes & give-aways and set up & staff booths: This is the same as with anyplace, but with being close to Omaha may open up some possibilities that may not travel to outstate area's.

6. Location is close to Omaha, about 15 minutes from downtown.

Issues that need to be overcome for this location to work, lots of neighbors to get permission from.  Lots of this land belongs to single individuals or companies so that should not be to difficult.  There is also some interesting other land out there that could add to the terrain experience that could be explored.

Crossing highways there are two highways to be crossed Highway 75 has two places that crossings may be available with no problems, under at the river (this may not be ideal depending upon water level etc.) and taking Laplatte RD which crosses under the highway,  The next is Highway 34 which Laplatte again crosses but it does not go under and it may require some backtracking to be a viable crossing, other crossing routes may be there as well.

Crossing Papillion Creek (if going all the way to Elbow Bend), there is a road (Harlan Lewis RD) that crosses and would put you on the Keystone Trail that runs right up to Elbow Bend.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2015, 01:24:28 PM by AAllen »

Offline AAllen

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #27 on: August 12, 2015, 01:32:14 PM »
As a note, I have not spoken with anyone other than some friends on the NRD board, and at the request of a board member the Director contacted me to send me maps, about this since I am not a representative of the NFOA who if we are putting this together as a fundraiser for the organization would need to make any agreements with gun clubs etc. (they could delegate that to someone but at this time we do not really have anyone that has been).  That communication was limited to the general idea and finding out where the properties are exactly and got into no detail.

Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #28 on: August 13, 2015, 03:41:02 PM »
Bellevue Rod & Gun certainly sounds like a top contender.  I received a note from the folks at Old Breed Gun Club (OBGC) today.  Most likely, I will be headed up there to cover their Walker Draw event the end of this month.  My digital magazine, Trek Tech Black will also be one of the sponsors.  Should make some good friends while I'm up there and hopefully have the opportunity to discuss a run and gun style event with them.

Offline AAllen

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #29 on: August 13, 2015, 03:46:39 PM »
They both sound like good possibilities, I just need to be careful since I run the PAF and once upon a time was spokesman for the NFOA to make certain that I do my best to keep a line drawn between the two organizations.

Offline tstuart34

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #30 on: August 13, 2015, 04:27:12 PM »
They both sound like good possibilities, I just need to be careful since I run the PAF and once upon a time was spokesman for the NFOA to make certain that I do my best to keep a line drawn between the two organizations.
Not sure where your line needs to be Allen but I think we have enough people to help you keep that line.

Has the NFOA board blessed this yet?

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Offline bkoenig

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #31 on: August 13, 2015, 09:39:44 PM »
Thanks for the legwork, guys.  If we can find a suitable location I'm sure we can get the rest to fall into place.

Offline NE Bull

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2015, 06:49:06 AM »
Not sure where your line needs to be Allen but I think we have enough people to help you keep that line.

Has the NFOA board blessed this yet?

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Is this a Official  NFOA event?  How does it fit our Mission. Goals?  Vision?  My opinion, as a lobbying org, this really doesn't fit.
BUT...
as with the PRS event Wallace put on, if ya'll wanted to put on such an event under your separate header and donate the proceeds to the NFOA, that would be fine.


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Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #33 on: August 14, 2015, 06:57:13 AM »
... if ya'll wanted to put on such an event under your separate header and donate the proceeds to the NFOA, that would be fine.

I seriously doubt that there will be much in the way of "proceeds."  The organizer of the event in Oklahoma said that he made about $200.  I'm certainly fine donating the proceeds, though.

Offline bkoenig

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #34 on: August 14, 2015, 08:00:07 AM »
Yeah, I see this as more of an independent event that the NFOA can use as a recruiting tool. 

Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #35 on: August 14, 2015, 08:58:53 AM »
Yeah, I see this as more of an independent event that the NFOA can use as a recruiting tool. 

I see the NFOA as a sponsor.  Most likely, the organization with the insurance will have to be the organizer of record.

Offline AAllen

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #36 on: August 14, 2015, 03:35:22 PM »
Well my opinion it should be an official NFOA event, and we be partnered with the other organization which has insurance.  Why, first we would want it to be able to raise as much money for the NFOA as possible.  To do so it is much easier to get sponsors who provide swag for competitors, nice prizes, and even put forth money to support and underwrite the event if the "Organizer" and beneficiary are an organization like the NFOA.  You could get a company like Cabela's (this is an example, I have no inside info on if or what they may do) to donate something to put into swag bags, possibly a prize of some sort and throw some money at the event to help with costs, then you get another sponsor who furnishes targets and a couple dollars.  In the end these couple dollars add up, and if you work it right you get the materials needed donated by the sponsors so costs are covered and the entry fees are also income.  Yes the first year of and event like this may have very limited income, but if you do it well future shoots will draw more Sponsor support and with it more income as well as better prizes and swag bags for competitors.

Now how does it fit the Mission, Goals and Vision?  Well it raises the profile of the NFOA amongst shooters, possibly bring positive press, all of which will help draw new members.  And along the way we can hope to raise some money, which even though there is nothing in our Mission about raising money it is needed for the organization to operate.  Sometimes you need to do things because just overall they can help the organization grow, even if it's not specifically covered in the Mission, Goals, and Vision.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2015, 03:44:44 PM by AAllen »

Offline tstuart34

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #37 on: August 14, 2015, 04:25:30 PM »
Well my opinion it should be an official NFOA event, and we be partnered with the other organization which has insurance.  Why, first we would want it to be able to raise as much money for the NFOA as possible.  To do so it is much easier to get sponsors who provide swag for competitors, nice prizes, and even put forth money to support and underwrite the event if the "Organizer" and beneficiary are an organization like the NFOA.  You could get a company like Cabela's (this is an example, I have no inside info on if or what they may do) to donate something to put into swag bags, possibly a prize of some sort and throw some money at the event to help with costs, then you get another sponsor who furnishes targets and a couple dollars.  In the end these couple dollars add up, and if you work it right you get the materials needed donated by the sponsors so costs are covered and the entry fees are also income.  Yes the first year of and event like this may have very limited income, but if you do it well future shoots will draw more Sponsor support and with it more income as well as better prizes and swag bags for competitors.

Now how does it fit the Mission, Goals and Vision?  Well it raises the profile of the NFOA amongst shooters, possibly bring positive press, all of which will help draw new members.  And along the way we can hope to raise some money, which even though there is nothing in our Mission about raising money it is needed for the organization to operate.  Sometimes you need to do things because just overall they can help the organization grow, even if it's not specifically covered in the Mission, Goals, and Vision.
I'm glad you posted this and I agree. I think there is more than $200 dollars to be made for the organization but it is going to take work to get the sponsors. I think one not sure how the guy is running the Oklahoma event but it sounds like he doesn't have much for sponsorships or they reinvest a lot of money into the event

Mud who puts this event on in Oklahoma? Gun club, organization, individual?

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Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #38 on: August 17, 2015, 07:39:04 AM »
Mud who puts this event on in Oklahoma? Gun club, organization, individual?

The Oklahoma Run and Gun is put on by a group of individuals.

Not surprisingly, I disagree with Andy.  Sponsors don't care if an event is put on by a charitable organization, a group of individuals or a for-profit corporation.  They care about two things:
1. How many people will attend
2. How professional will the event be

Sponsors are looking for as much exposure as possible and they want the event to reflect positively on them.

As with most first-year events, sponsors will be hard to come by.  There's no track record for the event.  The good news is that we have several businesses that are NFOA sponsors who might also be willing to sponsor an event like this.  The further good news is that I have a fair amount of experience getting sponsors for events ... and have sponsored a fair number of events.  The further good news is that my digital magazine, Trek Tech Black, usually has some cool SWAG laying around from the vendors whose products we have reviewed and I am willing to donate some of these items for the prize table.

With all that said, I seriously doubt that an event like this will produce much in the way of cash flow/proceeds to be donated to the NFOA.  The expenses - particularly in the first year - are significant and - again especially in the first year - the number of competitors should be limited to make the event more manageable.

Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Let's plan a run & gun!
« Reply #39 on: August 17, 2015, 08:08:08 AM »
As an exercise, here's a fairly exhaustive list of expenses for an event like this (some of these might not apply to this particular race):

1. Land rental
2. Insurance
3. Targets
4. Obstacles
5. Sign-up Processing Fees
6. Competitor ID Cards
7. Course Marking Materials (Cones, Barricades, Signs, Marking Tape, Cups, Tables, Chairs, Trash Cans ...)
8. T-shirts for Competitors
9. T-shirts for Volunteers
10. Safety Vests, etc. for Volunteers (Volunteers could be required to provide their own eye and ear protection)
11. Food
12. Water, Cups, Coolers
13. Ambulance
14. EZ Up Tents for Staff & Volunteers
15. Timing Equipment & Software
16. Permits (depending on location)
17. Generator
18. PA System
19. Fuel
20. Promotion/Advertising
21. Porta-johns
22. On-site Registration (Laptop, WiFi ...)
23. Leader Board (White Board, Chalk Board, TV ...)

Based on 50 competitors, at $75.00 per competitor, revenue would be in the $3750 ballpark.