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Author Topic: Gun safe questions  (Read 8698 times)

Offline OnTheFly

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Gun safe questions
« on: December 20, 2011, 11:11:40 PM »
Greetings all,

I am looking at gun safes at Orscheln and Tractor Supply.  Comparable products...Cannon, Liberty, and Winchester. 

20 cubic foot/22-24 long guns
http://www.orschelnfarmhome.com/gun-safe-20-cubic-ft-gloss-black/ctl16754/cp58278/si5182864/cl1/
http://www.tractorsupply.com/winchester-reg-gun-safe-24-gun-capacity-1043297
http://www.tractorsupply.com/cannon-safe-model-6028-19-44-cu-ft--1015639

Fat Boy Jr./
http://www.orschelnfarmhome.com/fatboy-jr-48-gun-safe/ctl16754/cp58278/si5522650/cl1/
http://www.tractorsupply.com/cannon-gun-safe-ts6040-60-in-h-36-gun-capacity-3910204

A few questions...

Does anyone have any advice about mechanical or electronic locks?  I've read a few reviews complaining about electronic locks.

Any general comment about the brands sold at these two stores?

If I could, I would drop two or three thousand dollars on a really nice safe, but that is not going to happen unless I win the lottery.

Fly
« Last Edit: December 20, 2011, 11:28:52 PM by OnTheFly »
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Offline RobertH

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #1 on: December 20, 2011, 11:32:50 PM »
i have an el cheapo safe.  if i had the money i would get...

1. good amount fireproofing
2. roomy safe.  guns multiply.
3. electronic pad and maybe a keyed backup entry
4. heavy and bulky enough that most bad guys would go after my TV's or other things first, since it would be easier to get.

i asked a few questions over at ar15.com a couple of years ago.  and from what i was told a crook will break into any safe, its just a matter of time and determination.
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Offline 00BUCK

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #2 on: December 21, 2011, 01:58:02 AM »
I have a dial lock on mine. Electronic is quicker but if you fat-finger it 3 times in a row you are usually locked out for 15 minutes. Not acceptable to me in a SHTF situation, but that is just my preference.

Offline Lmbass14

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #3 on: December 21, 2011, 08:02:28 AM »
Did a lot of research on safes.  In a nutshell RobertH is pretty much on target.  The following are my findings:

- Don't buys safes from Mexico or foreign countries.  Tractor Supply have safes that are made in Mexico.  Liberty, Canon and Fort Knox (there may be more but these are the ones I'm most familiar with) are made in U.S.A.

- Fire rating should be longer than how fast the fire dept. can respond to your house + 30 min. just in case they are on another call.  And at least 95,000 btu's.  The bottom line is to make sure that the interior of the safe stays as cool as possible.

- Locking bolts should be at least 1 1/8 in dia. on all four sides.  Some expensive safes have locking bolts on the corners also since that is the weakest part of a safe.

- Hinges should be on the outside (door open wider), a common statement is than the BG's can cut the hinges.  Don't think so.  First off, the BG time is limited so they need to bring a portable torch or saws all and 2nd the longer throw of bolts and pry guards on the safe will make the BG life harder.

- Should have interior lighting and humidity control.

- Like RobertH said, guns procreate so get a safe 1 and 1/2 times of your long guns.

- The safe should be bolted down (either floor or wall).  That way the bad guys can't tip it over for easier access or remove it from the home.  Not in the garage.  In the basement out of view.

- The better safes have 11 gauge sheet metal or thicker ( lower number is thicker)

- Electronic vs Dial - mixed emotions on that one, but get the brand should be Sargent and Greenleaf (they make the best locks).

- Place a "Black Powder Inside" label on the safe even though you don't have any.  The BG don't know either.

- Buy the best safe you can afford.

- Have them deliver and install the safe.  Might cost a couple hundred more, but to me it's worth it.  That way I don't have to visit the back cracker.  Not curbside.  Good safes weigh 800 lbs +, plus they do that for a living.

Can't think of anything else worth noting.

Bernie

Offline OnTheFly

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #4 on: December 21, 2011, 08:41:58 AM »
- Don't buys safes from Mexico or foreign countries.  Tractor Supply have safes that are made in Mexico.  Liberty, Canon and Fort Knox (there may be more but these are the ones I'm most familiar with) are made in U.S.A.

I'm a little confused on this statement.  You say that Tractor Supply has safes that are made in Mexico, but then you say that Cannon is made in the U.S.A.  However, Tractor Supply is advertising Cannon safes.  What am I not understanding here? 

Thanks,
Fly
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Offline Lmbass14

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #5 on: December 21, 2011, 08:52:06 AM »
OnTheFly, When I was doing the research, Tractor supply was carrying more than one brand of safes, and can't remember the brand but it was clearly marked on the back that is was made in Mexico.  Hope this answers your question.  Think the smaller ones might be Sentry or Stack-On, but can't swear to it.  Can't remember the manufacturer of the bigger safes they had on display.

And remember this was a couple of years ago.

Bernie

Offline CitizenClark

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #6 on: December 21, 2011, 08:54:43 AM »
I have a dial lock on mine. Electronic is quicker but if you fat-finger it 3 times in a row you are usually locked out for 15 minutes. Not acceptable to me in a SHTF situation, but that is just my preference.

Just one datapoint among many, but for what it is worth, I've had a Sentry fire safe with electronic keypad for ten years. I have never once been locked out. I have gone through a grand total of three 9v batteries in that time.

If the apocalpyse comes or we descend into a Mad Max type scenario, is this the safe I would pick? No, because it requires batteries to operate. Do I think that it is totally fine for my foreseeable needs in the future? Yes, I do (except that I need more safe space now that my addiction has outgrown my existing safe).

Offline metaldoc

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #7 on: December 21, 2011, 09:07:11 AM »
I have a Liberty Safe I'm satisfied with (bought it a Orschlen's several years ago).  It has the dial lock.  I've had two small gun boxes with electronic locks that failed... no more electronic locks for me. 

All the advice given is good.  Cheap = little or no fire protection. 

The other point to be re-emphasized is bolt it down.

Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2011, 10:58:53 AM »
I'm a firm believer in diversification ... on many fronts, including gun safes.  I would much rather have several smaller safes, potentially in different locations, than I would a single monster of a safe. 

YMMV

If you don't want to spend the money on a safe that has its own lighting or if you don't want to go to a lot of trouble putting AC lights in your safe(s), I think I posted on here that I found a battery-powered LED light that includes a magnetic mount.  IIRC, I found them at Home Depot.  The LED light is quite powerful.  You can set it to be motion-activated or turned on manually.  After going through batteries pretty quickly on the motion-activated setting, I've switched to manual.

Home Depot Link: http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202024426/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053

I also like a digital keypad with a keyed lock for backup purposes.  Don't keep the key on top of the safe.   ;D

Offline Chris C

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #9 on: December 21, 2011, 04:42:36 PM »
I have a Superior safe made by Champion that I got from Scheels and love it.  I opted for the old style mechanical dial for less chance of failure.

If you do buy a safe I read on another forum that golf balls work good to move them.  Since mine weighs in at nine hundred and twenty some pounds and I don’t need to move it I’d be interested to hear if this method works.  The guy swore by it. 

Offline FarmerRick

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #10 on: December 21, 2011, 05:17:22 PM »
Decide on the largest gun safe you can afford.

Then save up the money to get one at least half-again as big.   ;D



11gauge minimum, outside hinges,  S&G lock, bolt it down.
If the specs don't list the metal thickness, it's probably pretty thin.

Ultimate guide to safes: http://www.ar15.com/forums/f_6/46_Safes_andamp__Home_Security.html

Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.

Offline Lmbass14

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #11 on: January 25, 2012, 07:58:03 AM »
Fly, did u get a safe?  What kind did you end up getting?

Offline OnTheFly

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2012, 09:50:25 PM »
Fly, did u get a safe?  What kind did you end up getting?

No I have not.  I keep going back and forth on the issues I am facing.  I want a larger safe as everyone is suggesting.  However, I am limited by my basement stairs in both load bearing capacity and dimensions.  I have briefly considered having it upstairs or in the garage, but that will defeat several of the purposes.  The assembled safes would be great, but they are quite expensive.

I have a temporary part time job providing contract services, so maybe I can spend the money soon.

Fly
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Offline OnTheFly

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #13 on: March 05, 2012, 01:50:02 PM »
Does anyone have an opinion on putting the safe in an upstairs room?  To get the size I want, I will likely have to put it in my bedroom closet due to the basement restrictions.  I would have to bolt it down through the wood floors (sub-floor and finished wood).  Is this a bad idea or are there extra precautions to take when bolting it down?

Thanks,
Fly
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Offline Mudinyeri

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #14 on: March 05, 2012, 02:00:55 PM »
No I have not.  I keep going back and forth on the issues I am facing.  I want a larger safe as everyone is suggesting.  However, I am limited by my basement stairs in both load bearing capacity and dimensions.  I have briefly considered having it upstairs or in the garage, but that will defeat several of the purposes.  The assembled safes would be great, but they are quite expensive.

I have a temporary part time job providing contract services, so maybe I can spend the money soon.

Fly

Not EVERYONE is suggesting a larger safe.  :D

Offline bullit

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #15 on: March 05, 2012, 02:14:06 PM »
Any particular reason you want to bolt it down if in an upstairs closet?  Weight and location alone would be deterent enough I would think....

Offline metaldoc

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #16 on: March 05, 2012, 02:14:25 PM »
Here's a good video on Dial Locks vs. Electronic Locks...


Offline OnTheFly

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #17 on: March 05, 2012, 02:29:31 PM »
Any particular reason you want to bolt it down if in an upstairs closet?  Weight and location alone would be deterent enough I would think....

The size and location of the closet would not be enough of a deterrent to removing it from the house.  Or, if they had time, turning the safe and laying it on its back to pry it open.  A majority of the advise I have read says to bolt it down.

Fly
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Offline OnTheFly

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #18 on: March 05, 2012, 02:33:11 PM »
Not EVERYONE is suggesting a larger safe.  :D

I have read that opinion too.  One safe with everything in it takes X minutes to get into.  Four safes with your guns spread throughout means 4 times X minutes to get to all of your collection.  I'm not getting a HUGE safe.  Thinking of a 26-30 gun safe which realistically means it will hold 13-15 long guns.  I'm hoping there will be reason in the future to buy another safe.   ;D

Fly
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Offline kozball

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Re: Gun safe questions
« Reply #19 on: March 05, 2012, 02:59:19 PM »
Fly,

What is different about the stairs going up to the bedroom vs the stairs going to the basement? Are they obviously constructed differently?
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