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Author Topic: Charging Handle Upgrade?  (Read 2777 times)

Offline NB

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Charging Handle Upgrade?
« on: January 22, 2013, 07:57:42 PM »
Does anybody have any thoughts on charging handles?  I bought a Troy 5.56 Carbine and the charging handle seems like it is not all that solid.  Is it worth an upgrade?  What does the upgrade get you, performance-wise?  It looks like it's Gunfighter, or nothing. 

Incidentally, I used the charging handle alot this weekend due to what appears to be a leaking front gas block.  1 shot... rack it... 1 shot...  repeat...  I will be placing a call to Troy in the morning regarding that.
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Offline Phantom

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2013, 08:14:51 PM »
Quote from: NB on January 22, 2013, 07:57:42 PM
Does anybody have any thoughts on charging handles?  I bought a Troy 5.56 Carbine and the charging handle seems like it is not all that solid.  Is it worth an upgrade?  What does the upgrade get you, performance-wise?  It looks like it's Gunfighter, or nothing.

Charging handles are more personal likes or dislike then they are function/performance (they either work or don't work)

Quote from: NB on January 22, 2013, 07:57:42 PM
Incidentally, I used the charging handle alot this weekend due to what appears to be a leaking front gas block.  1 shot... rack it... 1 shot...  repeat...  I will be placing a call to Troy in the morning regarding that.

Did the case eject ?
If it did not  and it did before could also be the extractor spring.
 
But If this is the first time your firing it and it didn't work then beside the other 2 items being that it's a Carbine it might be the wrong size buffer or wrong buffer spring (or both).


Others might have other ideas as well.
 
« Last Edit: January 22, 2013, 08:18:39 PM by Phantom »
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Offline NB

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2013, 08:45:57 PM »
I ran about 140 rounds of .223 through it a few weeks ago with no fails to feed, then it started short stroking on the last mag.  It's been ejecting the rounds so far (not very forcefully), but the lug is creasing the top of the brass of the next bullet.  This weekend, it fed a few rounds of 5.56 then quit altogether.  But it still ejected the spent casings.  The gas key looks pretty solid, but the gas tube has carbon around the front gas block and the tube feels a little bit loose, so that's probably the issue.  It also looks like the front gas block is about a 1/16th of an inch from seated against a shelf on the barrel, so maybe it slid forward a bit.
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Offline bkoenig

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2013, 09:15:06 PM »
Is the gas block pinned or held in place with a set screw or clamp?  It does sound like it may have worked itself loose.   

I've never really had a desire for anything other than a standard charging handle.  One of the big ones might be nice while wearing thick gloves, but I've never had a problem.
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Offline NB

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #4 on: January 22, 2013, 09:50:15 PM »
It's not pinned.  Just a couple of staked set screws on the bottom.  I am not sure what I need to do to adjust (tighten) a staked set screw.  I'm calling Troy in the morning to see what they'll do for me.  I suppose they'll want me to mail it in, which won't hurt my feelings any since it's flipping cold outside anyways, and I won't feel like shooting until it warms up a bit.

It seems like I read something about pins versus screws online, but to tell the honest truth, ar15.com gets a little hard to straighten out the important details from the unimportant details.  Everybody is so set in their positions that you can't tell what's important.  I tried to do a little research before I bought, but the blizzard of information was a bit overwhelming.  So at the end of the day, I bought a gun that looked cool.  ;-)

Regarding the charging handle, this is my first AR, so I am not familiar with the necessity or functionality of some of the upgrades.  It seems to me that you can't just walk into Cabelas and find a big selection of upgradeable AR parts.  If I could see it and handle it, then I could compare a little bit, and see what the upgrades get me.  Does Moeller have stuff in his shop, or is it all online?  I've never been in there.  I should stop down there sometime and grab a NFOA shirt while I'm at it.
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Offline bkoenig

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2013, 10:01:27 PM »
Set screw gas blocks can come loose, especially if there isn't a dimple in the barrel for the screw to seat against.  I would't be surprised if it's shifted a little.  Pinned ones are the most secure.

I've never been in to Rod's shop either, I don't make it to Omaha much.  Maybe he'll chime in here.
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Offline camus

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #6 on: January 22, 2013, 10:04:53 PM »
I cannot comment on the issues you are having. My only comment is this, the standard vs other CH will have an impact on how you are able to manipulate the weapon.

Most my experience has been with the standard CH, I recently have been working with a BCM Mod 4 (or whatever the medium  is). I scoffed at it at first but it does worked as advertised. Did you go with Troy because you needed an ambi lever?
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Offline dukduk

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #7 on: January 22, 2013, 10:05:53 PM »
aside from the PRI Gasbuster I don't know of any "performance enhancing CHs, All it does is keep blowback out of your face, specifically for suppressor use.  If you're a lefty, the rainier raptor or the newest BCM Gunfighter are truly ambidextrous
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Offline ckspeed

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #8 on: January 22, 2013, 11:11:20 PM »
I have a BCM Gunfighter (medium) CH on my AR and really like it so far. No other reason than it's super easy to operate with gloves on, and looks cool too.... 8)

http://www.bravocompanyusa.com/BCM-GUNFIGHTER-Charging-Handle-GFH-Mod-4-p/bcm%20gfh%20mod%204%20556.htm
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Offline 00BUCK

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #9 on: January 22, 2013, 11:52:29 PM »
Quote from: NB on January 22, 2013, 08:45:57 PM
It also looks like the front gas block is about a 1/16th of an inch from seated against a shelf on the barrel, so maybe it slid forward a bit.
Most gas block are designed to have a 1/16th gap. They do that for weapons that might have a standard front hand guard mount. I always set mine 1/16th forward of the stop. Have a good look at the tail of the bolt - thick carbon build up there can prevent the bolt from retracting completely. I recommend the CAT-M4 cleaning tool for quick field bolt cleaning and detailed "inspection" quality cleaning later. http://www.catm4.com
As far as charging handles - the BCM Gunfighter is a nice upgrade. I have several of them. Keep in mind that it will do nothing to correct the issues you are having, but does make racking the bolt a little easier / faster.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2013, 11:55:06 PM by 00BUCK »
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Offline cckyle

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #10 on: January 23, 2013, 02:40:45 AM »
I have read that the over sized charging handles or rather the use of the extended release puts increased pressure on the right side of it and can cause the part to break.  I have a friend who has one and I can tell when you pull on it that it does pull it harder to the right rather than pulling pressure straight back.  Take that for what it's worth.  I imagine if you are not shooting or messing with your AR a lot it won't matter.  However I have the standard charging handle on my ARs and have never had any problems or wanted to swap them out yet. 

As far as your malfunctions I am by no means an expert but if I was you I would inspect it carefully, clean it really well, and make sure to lubricate it properly and well.  I lube mine with grease, not oil, and have had better results than friends who use oil.  They do make gas tube cleaners/brushes/pipe cleaner things, I haven't ever used one though.  Gas block and gas key, I don't think these are likely your problem, but could be.  I would try these other things before sending it in.  It could be the ammo you are using too.  You should be able to shoot anything out of them, but it's not always the case.  I have a friend who has an AR15 that will not lock the bolt back on the last round with any .223, but when he shoots 5.56 it functions properly.  Not as big of a deal as you are having but... maybe something to think about.     

« Last Edit: January 23, 2013, 02:45:44 AM by cckyle »
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Offline NB

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #11 on: February 02, 2013, 06:02:15 PM »
Quick followup on the short stroking Troy Carbine:  I mailed my evil black assault carbine off to Troy and they installed a new barrel, front gas block and gas tube.  I haven't had a chance to shoot yet, but I can state that it was in their shop for less than a day before they mailed it back to me (2nd day air).  So the customer service side was excellent.  I did send a  sniffer email back to them asking exactly what the issue was, and if there was anything I needed to look for, but they didn't respond to that mail.  I was more interested to see if they would disclose any production issues, since it was kind of weird to swap the barrel out (in my opinion).
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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2013, 11:34:00 PM »
make one wonder
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Offline Phantom

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Re: Charging Handle Upgrade?
« Reply #13 on: February 03, 2013, 09:58:29 AM »
It was quicker to change it out then take the time to troubleshoot it.

Makes for better Customer service and keeps the customer (you) happy.

The old one I'm sure will now be checked, refurbished and then sold or used on future returned units

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"If the primates that we came from had known that someday politicians would come out of the...the gene pool, they'd a stayed up in the trees and written evolution off as a bad idea.....Hell, I always thought the opposable thumb was overrated.  "-- Sheridan, "Babylon 5"
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