NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Events => Topic started by: Wildgoose on February 09, 2011, 06:26:58 AM
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Lincoln Izzak Walton will be holding a new informal match for the older militay bolt rifles like the Mosin-Nagants, Swiss, Mauser and others. It will be run from April to October of this year. The exact dates are still being sorted out yet so you will need to check the Lincoln Ike's web site ( http://lincolnikes.org/ ) to see when they will be as things get sorted out. Click on the Calander of Events option on the left side bar.
It would take up to much bandwidth to give all of the details here so if you are interested PM me with your e-mail and I can send you a flier with the course of fire, allowed rifles, ammo, ect. Or check out the write up on Ike's web site when it gets posted.
It may be a few days until the web site calander and match information gets updated so keep checking or get in touch with me.
Goose
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I hope I can use my Swiss K-31.
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K31's are welcome, basically as long as it was issued by a military at one time and has a manually operated bolt. The intent is to have a fun match that's easy for the average Joe to get into. It's a "run what ya brung" sort of thing. If anyone wants to try it but doesn't have a rifle PM me - you buy the ammo and you can use one of mine.
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If anyone wants to try it but doesn't have a rifle PM me - you buy the ammo and you can use one of mine.
Ditto here! PM Sent
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Maybe I should splurge and get some ammo for my Swiss Vetterli. Have not shot it yet, and I'm wondering just how accurate it will be.
Fly
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Maybe I should splurge and get some ammo for my Swiss Vetterli. Have not shot it yet, and I'm wondering just how accurate it will be.
Fly
Now that would be cool. I've been trying to convince my wife that I need a Finn 28/76 for this but I'm not having any luck. Something about the $900 price tag.
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Optics allowed?
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Optics allowed?
There will be a separate class for optics.
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Interesting ... I have a Springfield and an Enfield that I haven't shot in years. Guess I'll have to dig them out of the safe and see if they still go bang.
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The match rules, allowed rifles and course of fire are listed on Lincoln Ikes web site now. Just check on the left side of the page under CLUB ACTIVITIES, RIFLE. So is the schedule in the Calander of Events area.
http://lincolnikes.org/
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It will be just my daughter and I that weekend due to Daddy gettin some 'sweet' tickets to Miranda Lambert (it's a toss up on who is more excited) ;)
Anyway I was wondering who I would talk to about maybe letting some of the youngun's shoot some .22 'training rifles' when we all get done. Maybe move the targets in to 50 yards or so?
I have access to a Russian TOZ -magfed Bolt action that was supposedly a training rifle.
I figure any bolt action iron sight rimfire would suffice. Would be a great time to mentor our young.
Just a thought I'd throw it out there.
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I think that's a great idea. If we don't have enough spots on the line during the match for the rimfires I would be willing to hang around after.
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I'm pretty excited about this match. I sized and primed some 7.62x54R brass tonight. I need to work up a load - I'm thinking of starting really light with some pulled .311 150grain bullets and 35 grains of IMR 4895. Load data for this caliber is pretty scarce, so I'm using .303 British as a starting point and starting at the low end.
This old gal is getting hungry, I need to feed her:
(http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg215/bkoenig1975/m39b.jpg)
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Just back from the Appleseed and man I am beat. Learned a lot and had a good time at it though. I have load data for the 54R in a couple of my older loading manuals. Let me know if you are interested.
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Hodgdon/IMR/Winchester has a pretty extensive database on their website.
I got this data from here. http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp (http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp)
The format doesn't show up well on this board but the link above is well put together.
It shows a starting charge for the 150 Gr. at 46 Gr. of H4895 and max. charge at 49.5 Gr. compressed.
35 Gr. looks awfully light.
Cartridge: 7.62 x 54R
Load Type: Rifle
Starting Loads
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Bullet Weight, Manufacturer, Powder, Bullet Diam., C.O.L. Grs. Vel.(ft/s), Pressure, Grs. Vel.(ft/s) Pressure
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110 GR. HDY SP Hodgdon Varget .308" 2.715" 51.0 3016 34,700 CUP 55.0C 3200 39,900 CUP
110 GR. HDY SP Hodgdon BL-C(2) .308" 2.715" 56.0 3141 34,200 CUP 60.0 3376 42,300 CUP
110 GR. HDY SP Hodgdon H335 .308" 2.715" 51.0 3126 36,300 CUP 54.5 3332 45,200 CUP
110 GR. HDY SP Hodgdon H4895 .308" 2.715" 51.0 3150 35,500 CUP 55.0C 3345 43,400 CUP
110 GR. HDY SP Hodgdon Benchmark .308" 2.715" 47.0 3060 39,700 CUP 50.5 3213 44,900 CUP
125 GR. SIE SP Hodgdon Varget .308" 2.715" 51.0 2967 37,400 CUP 55.0C 3139 45,700 CUP
125 GR. SIE SP Hodgdon BL-C(2) .308" 2.715" 56.0 3094 37,500 CUP 60.0 3298 45,100 CUP
125 GR. SIE SP Hodgdon H335 .308" 2.715" 50.0 2997 36,500 CUP 53.0 3193 45,100 CUP
125 GR. SIE SP Hodgdon H4895 .308" 2.715" 50.0 3036 36,700 CUP 54.0C 3236 45,700 CUP
150 GR. NOS BT Hodgdon Varget .308" 2.875" 47.0 2721 38,000 CUP 50.5 2985 46,400 CUP
150 GR. NOS BT Hodgdon BL-C(2) .308" 2.875" 52.0 2878 40,200 CUP 55.5 3027 46,300 CUP
150 GR. NOS BT Hodgdon H335 .308" 2.875" 46.0 2751 38,800 CUP 49.5 2918 45,900 CUP
150 GR. NOS BT Hodgdon H4895 .308" 2.875" 46.0 2769 38,000 CUP 49.5C 2938 46,300 CUP
165 GR. BAR XBTC Hodgdon H4350 .308" 2.950" 52.0 2608 36,300 CUP 55.0C 2740 41,500 CUP
165 GR. BAR XBTC Hodgdon H414 .308" 2.950" 49.0 2521 33,600 CUP 52.0 2669 41,400 CUP
165 GR. BAR XBTC Hodgdon H380 .308" 2.950" 47.0 2499 35,900 CUP 50.0 2629 40,800 CUP
165 GR. BAR XBTC Hodgdon Varget .308" 2.950" 45.0 2581 39,800 CUP 48.3 2727 46,000 CUP
165 GR. BAR XBTC Hodgdon H4895 .308" 2.950" 44.0 2633 40,200 CUP 47.0 2761 45,800 CUP
180 GR. SFT SCIR Hodgdon H4831 .308" 2.975" 51.0 2281 31,900 CUP 55.0C 2484 39,200 CUP
180 GR. SFT SCIR Hodgdon H4350 .308" 2.975" 51.0 2493 37,600 CUP 55.0C 2692 44,700 CUP
180 GR. SFT SCIR Hodgdon H414 .308" 2.975" 49.0 2478 38,600 CUP 52.0 2622 45,600 CUP
180 GR. SFT SCIR Hodgdon H380 .308" 2.975" 47.0 2430 38,200 CUP 50.0 2542 42,000 CUP
180 GR. SFT SCIR Hodgdon Varget .308" 2.975" 43.0 2409 38,400 CUP 46.5C 2575 45,900 CUP
180 GR. SFT SCIR Hodgdon H4895 .308" 2.975" 42.0 2482 40,900 CUP 45.4C 2618 45,800 CUP
200 GR. SPR SP Hodgdon H4831 .308" 2.950" 52.0 2348 41,100 CUP 55.0C 2468 45,700 CUP
200 GR. SPR SP Hodgdon H4350 .308" 2.950" 48.0 2329 37,400 CUP 52.0 2529 46,500 CUP
200 GR. SPR SP Hodgdon H414 .308" 2.950" 48.0 2396 40,500 CUP 51.0 2526 45,500 CUP
200 GR. SPR SP Hodgdon H380 .308" 2.950" 46.0 2337 41,200 CUP 49.0 2432 46,600 CUP
200 GR. SPR SP Hodgdon Varget .308" 2.950" 41.0 2304 41,500 CUP 44.0 2412 46,000 CUP
200 GR. SPR SP Hodgdon H4895 .308" 2.950" 39.0 2271 41,400 CUP 42.2 2411 46,400 CUP
220 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon H4831 .308" 2.830" 50.0 2209 39,100 CUP 54.0C 2381 46,000 CUP
220 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon H4350 .308" 2.830" 47.0 2227 37,600 cup 50.5C 2396 45,900 CUP
220 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon H414 .308" 2.830" 47.0 2296 40,200 CUP 49.5 2401 44,500 CUP
220 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon H380 .308" 2.830" 43.0 2145 39,400 CUP 46.0 2274 45,900 CUP
220 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon Varget .308" 2.830" 40.0 2178 42,300 CUP 42.5 2269 46,000 CUP
220 GR. HDY JRN Hodgdon H4895 .308" 2.830" 38.0 2143 41,200 CUP 41.0 2263 46,600 CUP
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Thanks, I looked on the Hodgdon site but somehow I couldn't find the 7.62 loads.
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Ok, got some loads ready to test out for the M39. Not sure how I couldn't find 7.62x54R the first time around, so that's why I was using .303 as a starting point since it operates at a lower pressure.
I've been looking around for another vintage military rifle and almost bit on a really nice No.4 MK1 Enfield at Cabelas yesterday. In fact I had it in my hand and was walking over to my wife to beg for it when I changed my mind at the last minute. I'm glad I did because tonight I ordered another Enfield...a really old one:
http://www.ima-usa.com/british-p-1864-snider-type-breech-loading-infantry-rifle-with-short-socket-bayonet-untouched.html (http://www.ima-usa.com/british-p-1864-snider-type-breech-loading-infantry-rifle-with-short-socket-bayonet-untouched.html)
(http://www.ima-usa.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/265x265/0aa9d39765634cd6ff9e5b085da19619/N/B/NB1003U-2.jpg)
It's an 1864 Snider-Enfield. These were 1853 Enfield muzzle loader rifled muskets that were converted to breechloaders in order to shoot a black powder cartridge round - .577 bore! The U.S. did basically the same thing when they came up with the Trap Door Springfield. I always wanted a Trap Door, but I never knew it would be an Enfield. :D IMA found a ton of them in Nepal, along with a bunch of Martini-Henry's. A lot of guys are buying these, cleaning them up, and making nice shooters out of them. They look horrible, but all the Yak grease on them has protected them for the last 150 or so years.
Here's a thread about restoring them. As you can see they turn out pretty nice:
http://britishmilitariaforums.yuku.com/topic/9208/t/Readyman-s-IMA-Untouched-Snider-Short-Rifle-get-one-.html (http://britishmilitariaforums.yuku.com/topic/9208/t/Readyman-s-IMA-Untouched-Snider-Short-Rifle-get-one-.html)
(http://i104.photobucket.com/albums/m170/gotmailnow/Snider%20Carbine/Completed/PICT0130.jpg)
It's not really suitable for this match, but it looks like I'll have a new rifle (eventually) for the Ike's BPCR game!
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gah, sporterized is verbotten
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gah, sporterized is verbotten
I hear ya...but there are plenty of already sporterized K98's, 1903's, and Enfields that are waiting for good homes. They're kind of like lost puppies.
I have to confess I'm guilty of sporterizing one gun, but it was a rifle that had nothing salvageable except the bare action. I really need to finish that project some day.
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my 35 Whelen is already done, and so is dad's 30-06 (both K98s)... such is life.
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First match is April 9th at 8:00 AM. We'll have a sight in period to get these old warhorses on paper, then it's 10 rounds each prone, sitting, and offhand. There are three classes - stock rifles (no aftermarket sights), target rifles (aftermarket sights allowed), and sniper (optics allowed). The complete match rules and schedule are available at http://lincolnikes.org/ .
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Just a reminder, the first match is a week from today at 8:00. Bring those Mosins, Springfields, Mausers, K31's, etc. On second thought, leave the K31's at home. They're too accurate and I won't have a chance. :P
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Just a reminder, the first match is a week from today at 8:00. Bring those Mosins, Springfields, Mausers, K31's, etc. On second thought, leave the K31's at home. They're too accurate and I won't have a chance. :P
Are you going to accuse me of cheating then? :P
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You know, i may have to sneak down and take a look at this, sounds like an interesting time.
My 1891 wants to belch, but all i have are balkan surplus loads, so unreliable. Waiting to see if someone other than Stans in beatrice can get 7.65 ARG, kind of hard to justify a trip just for one box of rounds.
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aimsurplus.com has 7.65 Argentine. It's Privi Partisan, which is good quality ammo. It's brass cased and reloadable too.
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I'm a cash and carry guy, I prefer to make my purchases FTF, that way if I don't like what i see i'm not out the money.
I'm seeing if DE Guns can get me any.
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If you can make it to Lincoln I know Acher Arms used to have surplus 7.65. Not sure if they still do, you might want to call.
Just a heads up for everyone, I found out (from Wildgoose) that the range now requires chamber flags for all matches. I have some extras, but please bring them if you have them.
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i've bought about 100rnds from Acher, I live in lincoln.
I was aiming more towards something that could be reloaded. And I just dont trust that Balkan Surplus stuff lol.
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Heads up to everyone who shoots a Mosin 91/30. I just found a place that makes elevation adjustable sights, which would be a big help when shooting less than the 300 yards these were designed for:
http://smith-sights.yolasite.com/shop.php (http://smith-sights.yolasite.com/shop.php)
For as little as $10 he'll modify your existing sight, or for a little more you can buy one ready made.
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If I have a mosin with a scope on it (not the original) can I still shoot at this event?
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If I have a mosin with a scope on it (not the original) can I still shoot at this event?
Yes, scoped rifles shoot in a different class but they're welcome.
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I have a K98 that I have never shot - it belonged to my dad. It looks like the front sight has been drifted over to possibly sight in the rifle. I would like to get this sighted in and shoot in the matches but I am not sure what I would need to get it sighted in. I would appreciate any opinions.
Terry
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I have a K98 that I have never shot - it belonged to my dad. It looks like the front sight has been drifted over to possibly sight in the rifle. I would like to get this sighted in and shoot in the matches but I am not sure what I would need to get it sighted in. I would appreciate any opinions.
Terry
Hi Terry,
As the front sight has been moved I would bet the rifle is already sighted in. We shoot our match at a pretty close range so major sight moves are not often necessary and if the sight proves to be really stubborn you may be able to use "Kentucky Windage", just hold a bit off to one side or the other to put the shots in the black. Usually a small brass punch and a hammer to drift the sight over in the direction needed will get the job done. There are special tools made to accomplish this too but I am not aware in the case of the Mausers where they are available. Maybe some one else here can help you out in finding one.
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Next match is this Saturday!
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This still on? Can nonmembers shoot?
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Yes, it's on. Nonmembers are welcome.
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currently working on the first cup o' joe, i'll be heading down in the next 30 minutes or so. may bring the mosin down, either that or my argy.
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I shot much better this month. 277x woo hoo
BK I am gunning for you next time.
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Sounds like I'm going to have to buy one of those fancy Swiss rifles so I can stay ahead of you :D. Today was fun. I think the cold weather and all the high school graduations cut into our attendance. There was some darn good shooting. The first few places were pretty close. One shot could have changed everything.
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BK i can bring my argy out for you:)
Lots of fun despite the cold, after i get some trigger time i WILL be attending and shooting. Doubtfull that i will be any competition for ole dead eye Koening, but i'll hold my own.
BTW guys, it was COLD lol. I did snap some pics, i'll get them uploaded and post in a while.
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here are the two i snapped, need to enlist someone to photog these shoots, both for our benefit and that of the range.
(http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u156/topdownbimmer/SAM_0104.jpg)
(http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u156/topdownbimmer/SAM_0103.jpg)
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damn, i wish i could have come except i was delayed 2.5 hours in miami and then flight was cancelled and forced to fly out the next morning, missing the shoot. one main reason i got my mosin and i couldn't even use it! and im busy for the next few months, so i was very pissed.
btw, who won?
fyi - yes, miami had great weather, but i'd rather be back in nebraska shooting guns. :)
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Who do you think? :)
BK took it, 281x if i remember correctly.
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Next match is Saturday! Robert, you need to bring that shiny new Mosin of yours out. I just picked up a new to me No. 4 Mk2 Lee-Enfield. I may shoot that this weekend if I can get a good load developed. It's shooting right around 3 MOA with minimum power loads using pulled 150 grain Russian .311 bullets. I bet with good bullets it will really shine. Hmm....use the tried and true M39 or go with the new Enfield with that nice micrometer sight.....
I really dig these .31 caliber weirdos for some reason. I need an 1891 Argentine to round out the collection.
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hmmmmm...
if i did that my dad would kill me though.
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yes my mosin is shiny because i haven't shot it yet. its killing me!!!
and you're lucky i get to go. its my 10 year high school reunion that day, so i gotta head out of town after i kick your butt! :P
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(http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lfgcg5qzsl1qbvc38o1_400.jpg)
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(http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lfgcg5qzsl1qbvc38o1_400.jpg)
This just made my day.
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here are the two i snapped, need to enlist someone to photog these shoots, both for our benefit and that of the range.
gsd - I know a guy who rather enjoys collisions of firearms and photography....
(http://rluening.smugmug.com/Events/Runn-Irons-2010-Shoot/REL7360/1052232569_8EL33-XL.jpg)
More at:
http://rluening.smugmug.com/Events/Runn-Irons-2010-Shoot/14239712_PZohm (http://rluening.smugmug.com/Events/Runn-Irons-2010-Shoot/14239712_PZohm)
http://rluening.smugmug.com/Events/Kearney-Freedom-and-Fun-Shoot/6546181_2eSYZ#416423366_XDs2E (http://rluening.smugmug.com/Events/Kearney-Freedom-and-Fun-Shoot/6546181_2eSYZ#416423366_XDs2E)
Let me know.
/rl
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If i go, which i plan on doing, first cup of coffee is on me if you show up:) What can i say, I'm cheap lol. If I do go this weekend, i will be bring the 1891 out so I can make a fool of myself.
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If i go, which i plan on doing, first cup of coffee is on me if you show up:) What can i say, I'm cheap lol. If I do go this weekend, i will be bring the 1891 out so I can make a fool of myself.
We'll see. I may need to stick around Omaha on Saturday. If not, I will be camping down at Pawnee and should be able to come down to the range. I'll be the balding guy with a beard and a Nikon.
/rl
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I'll be the balding guy with a beard
that sounds like most of us...
ill be the balding guy with a beard wearing an NFOA shirt and carrying a mosin thats gonna rock brian's world. :P
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I'm hoping to be able to make it to this month's event, missed last month. We shall see. I might be helping my brother remove a tree at his house. Which I'm not really looking forward to, heh. Which gun should I bring if I make it? hmmmm....Maybe the M44 mosin. I know it's not all that accurate, but big fireballs would make the inevitable poor showing and sore shoulder worthwhile.
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that sounds like most of us...
ill be the balding guy with a beard
Hey! I resemble that remark!
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heh, i'm the bald guy with the moustache...
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It looks like I will be stuck in Omaha. I'll try to get down there for another match sometime. Maybe I can even scrounge up a rifle to bring...
/rl
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I have a mauser and a mosin, you're welcome to the mosin.
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Ok, I had exactly enough H4895 left to load up 40 rounds for the Enfield. Looks like it will be a game time decision. If I can get the Enfield sighted in within 10 rounds and it's looking good I'll go with it, otherwise it's back to the trusty M39.
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Thnking game called on account of rain this morning are we?
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I'm leaving my house in 10min, so it better be game on.
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ahh. I hadn't heard anything but rain since 0445 this morning. If its on Ike's is going to be a soupy mess. I may gas up and coffee up and slip down there as well.
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Naturally, after the match was over it gets nice and sunny.
I'll just leave this right here:)
http://s167.photobucket.com/albums/u156/topdownbimmer/?action=view¤t=CIMG0078.mp4 (http://s167.photobucket.com/albums/u156/topdownbimmer/?action=view¤t=CIMG0078.mp4)
Direct quote from BKoenig, "it's funny how everybody laughs after they shoot it."
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Awesome to see the old gun shooting! Once again, I had a great time, and my little brother did too, despite his "score". In fact, he admitted that he was aiming low (must have been a LOT low) and next time, he's using the same gun and he's going to redeem himself. Thanks to all who made this happen!
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The shooting keeps getting better and better. I think people are starting to figure these old guns out. Now you guys all need to come to next weekend's Appleseed so you can really whip me!
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The shooting keeps getting better and better. I think people are starting to figure these old guns out. Now you guys all need to come to next weekend's Appleseed so you can really whip me!
or in the spirit of RobertH...
Now that i have clearance to ues FMJ ammo, the mauser will come out of her sleeping bag and roar. Of course, if no one else shows up with a scope i am guaranteed a win...
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im sure brian is still hurting with my whooping i put on him!!
just kidding! i had a great time. i will try to come by as much as possible. i would encourage anyone wanting to stop by and just watch, do it! the trash talk is all in good fun though. :)
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By the way, my wife walked up behind me as I was playing that video and said "wow, your butt looks big."
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Note to Self...Film BK from the other side:)
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brian, i just remembered i filmed you shooting that old gun. ill have to post it or put it on facebook or something.
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yeah haha you filmed from the other side.
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July 23rd looks to be the next one! Who's in? I know I am this time for sure.
(aww crap that means i better go shoot and get better)
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i think ill be there. its my family reunion, so i don't quite know for sure. ill be ready to defend my 8th place! :)
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Not sure yet, I may be working an Appleseed in Grand Island.
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Ok, next match is Saturday. Hopefully the heat will subside and we'll finally have decent weather for one of these events. So far we've had freezing cold for the first two and rain for the second.
I think I have my new Lee-Enfield pretty much squared away so I hope to shoot it this weekend. I worked up a load that shoots pretty well, but it's still shooting pretty high. I may need a taller front sight.
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dont worry bk, i will be there hoping to improve on my awesome appearance last time.... and ill bring my new best friend so you can see it.
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And i plan on bring the Argy out as well.