NFOA MEMBERS FORUM
General Categories => Information Arsenal => Topic started by: FarmerRick on November 01, 2012, 10:57:26 AM
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http://www.omahapoa.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Fornoff-CCW-Interview.mp3 (http://www.omahapoa.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Fornoff-CCW-Interview.mp3)
I'd like other's opinions of the contents of this.
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When I hand the Officer my CHP and drivers license, state my carry position, have or not, that should be the end of it. I have proved that I am legally in possession of a firearm. That should be the end of it unless there is something obviously wrong.
If I need to step out of the car because I have a firearm, and I could stay in the car without a firearm, that seems discriminatory. If I say I have a CHP and no firearm and the officer asks to search the car, I would ask for, "for what reason?" If it is to look for a firearm...that would be just wrong.
Bottom line...I drive in a manner that prevents me from being stopped.
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Did I understand that right? That in the city of Omaha, to legally own a "concealable" weapon you either have to register it or have a CCW?
To OWN not to just to carry?
The definition of concealable in this instance was any weapon with a barrel length of under 16".
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Alas...that is the Omaha law!
Join the Facebook Omaha Police Department page and let's start talking to them. I asked about "Open Carry" so let's see where that goes!
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There were some statements that are not 100% accurate, but that gets into the details rather than the broad overview. Need to listen to it again when I have time to listen more carefully. Where did you find this?
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There were some statements that are not 100% accurate, but that gets into the details rather than the broad overview. Need to listen to it again when I have time to listen more carefully. Where did you find this?
They posted the link to it on their Facebook page. https://www.facebook.com/#!/OmahaPoliceDepartment (https://www.facebook.com/#!/OmahaPoliceDepartment)
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I may type up a transcript of this. Haven't listened to it yet (at work, can't focus on it and do other things).
Andy: Are there any legal concerns if a transcript of the dialog is posted ? I don't believe there are.
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Andy: Are there any legal concerns if a transcript of the dialog is posted ? I don't believe there are.
For something like this I do not believe there is, if it was a part of a network newscast etc. there would be. This is a communication between the OPD and the public done directly from them so if it was transcribed, to better make it available to the public, I believe that would be a public service.
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Straightforward Interview
Sgt. Fornoff has been very helpful to me in the past in his role as head of the Omaha Firearms Unit by answering my inquiries about various Omaha firearms situations. He's a no-bluster, even-spoken kind of person. Good LEO, so far as I can tell.
People just don't want to believe Omaha Municipal Code 20-251, which says that if the concealable firearm is brought into the city limits, it must be registered. Immediately. Right now. No 30 day grace period. Applies to anyone bringing the firearm, whether resident or not.
The Omaha Police Will Legally Grab Your Gun if it isn't registered, except for those who hold an NE CHP or from a state w/Nebraska CHP reciprocity. Happens all the time. Happens a lot.
How do you get a handgun registered before bringing it into Omaha? Take the paperwork down to OPD at 15th & Howard, get the gun registered, then go back to--say-- Scotts Bluff, NE, get the gun and bring it to Omaha. That's the desired Omaha drill, believe it or not. That's the standard procedure which must be used by Omaha gun dealers to sell guns in Omaha. Yes......it is. Unless you hold a CHP.
sfg
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What are the Lincoln laws on this subject? I am not a lawyer and really stink at reading law.
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He is evidently unaware of the change in Omaha's municipal code about a concealable weapon.
http://library.municode.com/index.aspx?clientId=10945 (http://library.municode.com/index.aspx?clientId=10945)
Sec. 20-191. - Definitions.
For the purposes of this article, the following words and phrases shall have the meanings respectively ascribed to them:
Concealable firearm: A firearm having an overall length of less than 26 inches.
Not a weapon with a 18" or shorter barrel, that was changed a while ago and he should be very aware of that change. Irresponsible at best to be giving out bad info to the public like this.
There are other inacuracies in this recording as well, I'll try to document them when I'm not at work.
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It is correct that the statute does not specify a time frame in which to register.
OPD will NOT register any handgun purchased outside Omaha city limits without the handgun being present.
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RLMoeller
Now....please forgive the Trick Question here.
How do you legally get the out-of-Omaha actual real, live unregistered handgun across the Omaha city limits and down to 15th and Howard to get it registered?? 'Cause, as soon as it crosses the line, it's illegal.
sfg
PS - I'm still handing out those NFOA brochures you gave me to my CHP classes. Plan to hand out 25 more on Sunday. May have to come back and get some more at this rate.
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Neeco...........
You can start here if you wish: http://www.lincoln.ne.gov/city/police/pdf/gun.pdf (http://www.lincoln.ne.gov/city/police/pdf/gun.pdf)
sfg
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You can't do it without violating the statute.
You should take it downtown, cased and unloaded with a copy of the sales receipt.
This is one of several issues we pressed them on when we finally had the opportunity to meet with them last year.
Basically, "if we don't think you are a problem, you won't be prosecuted, so there isn't really anything to be worried about."
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I have plenty of brochures, so whenever you need more drop on by.
That goes for anyone giving classes (or any event where brochures may be handy). If you need some, let me know.
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Neeco...........
You can start here if you wish: http://www.lincoln.ne.gov/city/police/pdf/gun.pdf (http://www.lincoln.ne.gov/city/police/pdf/gun.pdf)
sfg
Well the 2004 laws are now outdated, correct?
CAN A PERSON OBTAIN A SPECIAL PERMIT TO CARRY A HANDGUN?
In the State of Nebraska there are no special permits issued to carry a handgun on your person per the Secretary of State's Office other than law enforcement personnel, private investigators, or security personnel.
IS IT A LAW THAT YOU HAVE TO REGISTER A FIREARM?
Any person, firm, association, or corporation dealing in firearms of any type shall, on the same day of the sale of any firearm, except a shotgun or a rifle of a type commonly used for hunting, report the sale to the Police Department on forms as prescribed and furnished by the Police Department. The report shall contain all the information requested thereon.
You can contact the Lincoln Police Department at 441-7204 to discuss voluntary registration of your personal firearms. DO NOT bring your firearm to the Lincoln Police Department. If your registered weapon is stolen the Police Department would then have the serial number, model number, and brand name on file."
When here : http://cjis.lincoln.ne.gov/~lpd/gunreg/ (http://cjis.lincoln.ne.gov/~lpd/gunreg/) it says that any purchase by a dealer will be reported to LPD.
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Well the 2004 laws are now outdated, correct?
CAN A PERSON OBTAIN A SPECIAL PERMIT TO CARRY A HANDGUN?
In the State of Nebraska there are no special permits issued to carry a handgun on your person per the Secretary of State's Office other than law enforcement personnel, private investigators, or security personnel.
IS IT A LAW THAT YOU HAVE TO REGISTER A FIREARM?
Any person, firm, association, or corporation dealing in firearms of any type shall, on the same day of the sale of any firearm, except a shotgun or a rifle of a type commonly used for hunting, report the sale to the Police Department on forms as prescribed and furnished by the Police Department. The report shall contain all the information requested thereon.
You can contact the Lincoln Police Department at 441-7204 to discuss voluntary registration of your personal firearms. DO NOT bring your firearm to the Lincoln Police Department. If your registered weapon is stolen the Police Department would then have the serial number, model number, and brand name on file."
When here : http://cjis.lincoln.ne.gov/~lpd/gunreg/ (http://cjis.lincoln.ne.gov/~lpd/gunreg/) it says that any purchase by a dealer will be reported to LPD.
If you buy a handgun from a dealer, the dealer will report the sale to LPD. If you buy a handgun in Lincoln from another individual, one of you is supposed to report the sale to LPD.
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RLMoeller:
Bingo............Bringing the Gun into Omaha is Breaking the Law!!!!
Just as you said..........
Here are the options as I understand them:
1) Break the law, bring in the handgun, take it to OPD at 15th & Howard, get it registered.......immediately become legal. Hope you don't get busted on the way to OPD.
2) Get busted on the way, pointed toward the OPD station. Tell them you're actually on the way to OPD, 15th & Howard. Now....what Sgt. Fornoff told me is that you'll get a police escort all the way to the OPD Station. The LEO will follow behind to ensure timely arrival at the OPD gun registration window.
3) Get busted in Omaha, but not aimed toward the OPD station at 15th & Howard.........Goodbye handgun. Hello, citation. Maybe handcuffs. Fine up to $500 bucks, maybe 6 months in the fenced area out by the airport. [Could happen.] And no CHP for 10 years.
Funny [odd, not funny] that all this goes on in a state that the constitutional right to keep and bear arms on record since 1988 and "these rights shall not be infringed." The CRKBA are constantly under infringement.
sfg
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If you buy a handgun from a dealer, the dealer will report the sale to LPD. If you buy a handgun in Lincoln from another individual, one of you is supposed to report the sale to LPD.
Lincoln has changed its requirement and will not force the registration of handguns sold to a valid CHP holder. But all other buyers of handguns must sign a registration card that the Lincoln FFL fills out to report the sale to LPD
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Lincoln has changed its requirement and will not force the registration of handguns sold to a valid CHP holder. But all other buyers of handguns must sign a registration card that the Lincoln FFL fills out to report the sale to LPD
And if it wasn't purchased in Lincoln and I live in Waverly? Must it be registered?
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If the transaction took place outside Lincoln city limits, then there is no jurisdiction for Lincoln to enforce any ordinance. :P
Here is the ordinance
9.36.030 Report of Sale of Firearms.
Any person, firm, association, or corporation dealing in firearms of any type shall, on the same day of the sale of any firearm, except a shotgun or a rifle of a type commonly used for hunting, report the sale to the Police Department on forms as prescribed and furnished by the Police Department. The report shall contain all the information requested thereon. (Ord. 15625 §3; July
9, 1990: P.C. §9.28.025: Ord. 15443 §1; February 20, 1990: prior Ord. 7936 §1; December 26,
1962).
Here is a link to Lincoln Municipal Codes
http://www.lincoln.ne.gov/city/attorn/lmc/contents.htm#05 (http://www.lincoln.ne.gov/city/attorn/lmc/contents.htm#05)
This link is to the Lincoln Municipal code Title 9 section 9.36 = Weapons
http://www.lincoln.ne.gov/city/attorn/lmc/ti09/ch936.pdf (http://www.lincoln.ne.gov/city/attorn/lmc/ti09/ch936.pdf)
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A reply to Wilson (1) I would like to add my experience with a contact with a LEO. I always drive in a manner to eliminate any contact with LEO also. However, I was stopped by a NSP on a county road for a simple vehicle inspection, all vehicles were being stopped. No problems arose. My point here is that no matter how law abiding you may conduct your driving, sooner or later you will experience some type of contact. Hope when it happens you meet as courteous an officer as I did. :D
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To Poor Man: I have been stopped by Sarpy County Sheriff and it was a very pleasant experience...a non event. Many LEOs are happy to have us out there. :D
You are right though...someday it will happen. I hope it isn't in Omaha! :'(
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I think it is a good thing that OPD is actually reaching out and TRYING to give information to law abiding citizens and to answer the many questions that come up.
Yes it is unfortunate there is some inaccurate information in their interview as noted above. One other thing I noted is that the Sgt stated that it was not legal for "Aliens" to possess a handgun. Omaha better than anyone should know that LEGAL Aliens absolutely can possess a handgun........ (Since they were sued by SAF and NFOA and lost) Now the Sgt's statement would have been accurate if he would have said "ILLEGAL ALIENS cannot possess a handgun"
Many people mistakenly ask Police Officers to define what a law means and this is a huge mistake. Police Officers have way too much on their plate to have the statute books memorized... And I have seen too many examples where Officers DON'T know the gun laws and tell citizens bad info. They know what they need to know to get by on the street.
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So... we are supposed to pull our holstered gun out and give it to the officer and step out of the vehicle? I find that is more dangerous to do then to leave the loaded weapon holstered and reside inside the vehicle. Is this new? Maybe I need to take the class again....
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My advice that I give in class:
Don't reach for your permit, license or anything. Put your hands on the steering wheel and let the officer know you are carrying. IF they officer wants to take possession of the firearm and secure it, I would ask that the officer remove it from the holster. Me personally, I would not ever pull a gun out of a holster with an Officer standing there.
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Thats what I thought, but after listening to the audio recording it is so VERY vague. Glad I am still thinking correctly. Thanks Chris
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9.36.030 Report of Sale of Firearms.
Any person, firm, association, or corporation dealing in firearms of any type shall, on the same day of the sale of any firearm, except a shotgun or a rifle of a type commonly used for hunting, report the sale to the Police Department on forms as prescribed and furnished by the Police Department. The report shall contain all the information requested thereon. (Ord. 15625 §3; July
9, 1990: P.C. §9.28.025: Ord. 15443 §1; February 20, 1990: prior Ord. 7936 §1; December 26,
1962).
So is the purchase of an AR type weapon or a "police type" shotgun reported to LPD ?
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So is the purchase of an AR type weapon or a "police type" shotgun reported to LPD ?
Don't know that about, but I would assume they do. I have never bought a complete AR15 in Lincoln
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I use my ar for hunting.
does anyone know if a sbr/sbs/aow/machine guns have to be registered with OPD because they are "concealable"
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I use my ar for hunting.
does anyone know if a sbr/sbs/aow/machine guns have to be registered with OPD because they are "concealable"
According to this, if the firearm is less than 26" in total length, then YES
http://library.municode.com/index.aspx?clientId=10945
Sec. 20-191. - Definitions.
For the purposes of this article, the following words and phrases shall have the meanings respectively ascribed to them:
Concealable firearm: A firearm having an overall length of less than 26 inches.
Problem is, OPD was refusing to register these types of firearms in the past, but I don't know if the changes NFOA pushed through recently will change that or not.
Anyone else tried to register anything other than a handgun?
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I'd rather just get my ccw than pay any more money to the city.
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To quote Semper Fi Guy:
"People just don't want to believe Omaha Municipal Code 20-251, which says that if the concealable firearm is brought into the city limits, it must be registered. Immediately. Right now. No 30 day grace period. Applies to anyone bringing the firearm, whether resident or not.
The Omaha Police Will Legally Grab Your Gun if it isn't registered, except for those who hold an NE CHP or from a state w/Nebraska CHP reciprocity. Happens all the time. Happens a lot."
This is clearly an infringement upon our Second Amendment rights. This is a Federal Crime if you ask me. It would be a crime of "Infringement upon Second Amendment Rights." Each count would be added up based off of how many law-abiding citizens that are victimized.
They are breaking & ignoring our Constitutional rights.
From my understanding, the only recourse is a law-suit. In which case, the court judges are all working for the same entity. This is a very sad situation to say the least.
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Talk is cheap. Anyone who wants to be the test case, step up, and the NFOA and the 2nd amendment foundation will bring the lawsuits
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I had my experience with the O.P.D. & their registration process.
They told me that I can't own guns, I can't legally own them, I was dis-qualified, etc.
My quick fix was to get my CHP. I certainly did that.